OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]
#17
7'30" around the -ring is pretty amazing. I would be curious to know what the weight is of this car to compare with the current C2S
Jim
Jim
#18
Rennlist Member
Looks better than I thought. Pretty significant price increase though. Current gen costs 5k euros less judging by the msrp on the Germany website, which I am sure will translate to USD as well.
With turbo engine, aftermarket engine tuning support will be stronger as well (factory tune seems to be very conservative considering it is only making 420hp on a 3.0l flat six engine), which will makes things more interesting down the line.
With turbo engine, aftermarket engine tuning support will be stronger as well (factory tune seems to be very conservative considering it is only making 420hp on a 3.0l flat six engine), which will makes things more interesting down the line.
#19
Rennlist Member
I too am curious how much extra weight is in the new turbo 991.2s. I wonder if this was why they increased the width of the rear tires?
High performance twin turbo engines are notably more expensive to produce than NA engines, which I expect influenced the price.
It will be interesting to see what tuners do with these engines once they go out of warranty. I heard about lot of 997 turbos getting modified, but I thought the ECU was much harder to crack with the 991s?
There was one option I did find interesting-
"In combination with PDK transmission the mode switch has an additional button, the "Sport Response Button". When this button is pressed the drivetrain is pre-conditioned for maximum acceleration for 20 seconds, for example before overtaking manoeuvres. For this, the optimum gear is engaged and the engine management adjusted to an even more spontaneous response for a short time. "
Sounds like this is how you defeat turbo lag on the highway, when you have to "shoot the gap" quickly.
I'm still not buying a turbo, but this feature sounds like it will help the 991.2 to perform like an actual sports car when you need it to.
High performance twin turbo engines are notably more expensive to produce than NA engines, which I expect influenced the price.
It will be interesting to see what tuners do with these engines once they go out of warranty. I heard about lot of 997 turbos getting modified, but I thought the ECU was much harder to crack with the 991s?
There was one option I did find interesting-
"In combination with PDK transmission the mode switch has an additional button, the "Sport Response Button". When this button is pressed the drivetrain is pre-conditioned for maximum acceleration for 20 seconds, for example before overtaking manoeuvres. For this, the optimum gear is engaged and the engine management adjusted to an even more spontaneous response for a short time. "
Sounds like this is how you defeat turbo lag on the highway, when you have to "shoot the gap" quickly.
I'm still not buying a turbo, but this feature sounds like it will help the 991.2 to perform like an actual sports car when you need it to.
Last edited by Drifting; 09-07-2015 at 01:54 AM. Reason: .
#20
Rennlist Member
Porsche ECUs are historically easier to crack than other German manufacturers like BMW. Both Cobb and Giac has ECU flashes already for 991.1 turbo. Won't take that long for the 991.2 solutions to come out, considering how much money is there to be made for those companies.
While I understand some old schooler might lament the lost of NA engines, but personally, the combination of the 997 or even 991.1 Turbo level of power paired with a RWD chassis that actually have some frontal clearance would be more than ideal as a track able DD.
I am pretty confident these would drive very well, considering how sharp the non-GT chassis is at track even when weighted down by the AWD system in the 991.1 turbo. Now that we are sure that the facelift isn't all that terrible, I just hope Porsche got the exhaust sound right as well.
While I understand some old schooler might lament the lost of NA engines, but personally, the combination of the 997 or even 991.1 Turbo level of power paired with a RWD chassis that actually have some frontal clearance would be more than ideal as a track able DD.
I am pretty confident these would drive very well, considering how sharp the non-GT chassis is at track even when weighted down by the AWD system in the 991.1 turbo. Now that we are sure that the facelift isn't all that terrible, I just hope Porsche got the exhaust sound right as well.
#21
Three Wheelin'
Important bits from the evo articles ...........
Straight line performance and fuel efficiency have benefited from the switch to turbocharging, then, but logic suggests that throttle response, exhaust note and top-end fireworks – between them the three factors that can make an engine memorable rather than just effective – will have taken a backwards step.
When asked if he can understand that apprehension, senior Porsche engineer Dr Erhard Mössle says, ‘Yes, of course I can! The normally aspirated six-cylinder boxer is a famous engine in the 911, but we face some challenges, not only in terms of fuel consumption and emissions, but also from our competitors. When you look at our competitor cars, like the Mercedes-AMG GT S or other cars with turbocharged engines, it’s getting harder to stay close to them with a normally aspirated engine.
‘We tried to model a normally aspirated engine and avoid turbo lag as much as possible,’ he adds. ‘A lot of detail work has gone into the system to improve response. For instance, when you come off the throttle the turbos keep spinning, so they are running at a higher speed when you get back on the throttle. We also have a new sports exhaust system that sounds really good. Yes, it’s different to a normally aspirated engine, but it sounds better than the 911 Turbo, more emotional.’
Straight line performance and fuel efficiency have benefited from the switch to turbocharging, then, but logic suggests that throttle response, exhaust note and top-end fireworks – between them the three factors that can make an engine memorable rather than just effective – will have taken a backwards step.
When asked if he can understand that apprehension, senior Porsche engineer Dr Erhard Mössle says, ‘Yes, of course I can! The normally aspirated six-cylinder boxer is a famous engine in the 911, but we face some challenges, not only in terms of fuel consumption and emissions, but also from our competitors. When you look at our competitor cars, like the Mercedes-AMG GT S or other cars with turbocharged engines, it’s getting harder to stay close to them with a normally aspirated engine.
‘We tried to model a normally aspirated engine and avoid turbo lag as much as possible,’ he adds. ‘A lot of detail work has gone into the system to improve response. For instance, when you come off the throttle the turbos keep spinning, so they are running at a higher speed when you get back on the throttle. We also have a new sports exhaust system that sounds really good. Yes, it’s different to a normally aspirated engine, but it sounds better than the 911 Turbo, more emotional.’
#23
I'm actually happy with all the changes except the turbo engines. Some of the features were a long time coming. Visually, the car looks fine. The big unknowns are how it drives and how it sounds. I'll have to drive it and see. If it's awful as we all seem to fear with each new generation I still have my GTS.
Concerning the turbo engines. Until I have the chance to drive one, I won't bother commenting. But it is what it is. Every manufacturer is downsizing their engines and either moving towards forced induction or sometime of hybrid/electric powertrain. Was only a matter of time before it hit the daily driver vehicles like the 911 platform. Probably the best feature of turbocharged engines is the fairly cheap HP add-ons. I'd imagine once tuners get their hand on the TT3.0 platform.. that getting 500hp out of these will be relatively 'cheap' in Porsche speak.
#24
I like the exterior and interior changes, but what I like most is that you can now order the entry and drive and seat cooling as separate options instead of having to order an expensive package.
So for me it would be now a base car in GT Silver, with cooled (and for resale heated seats, which I will never use) and that's it, that's now close to a $93k car ... that kind of money used to buy you a base 'S"
Which means that my base 991.1 carrera is now amazing value to enter the 911 world!
So for me it would be now a base car in GT Silver, with cooled (and for resale heated seats, which I will never use) and that's it, that's now close to a $93k car ... that kind of money used to buy you a base 'S"
Which means that my base 991.1 carrera is now amazing value to enter the 911 world!
#25
I like the exterior and interior changes, but what I like most is that you can now order the entry and drive and seat cooling as separate options instead of having to order an expensive package.
So for me it would be now a base car in GT Silver, with cooled (and for resale heated seats, which I will never use) and that's it, that's now close to a $93k car ... that kind of money used to buy you a base 'S"
Which means that my base 991.1 carrera is now amazing value to enter the 911 world!
So for me it would be now a base car in GT Silver, with cooled (and for resale heated seats, which I will never use) and that's it, that's now close to a $93k car ... that kind of money used to buy you a base 'S"
Which means that my base 991.1 carrera is now amazing value to enter the 911 world!
#26
Drifting
#27
Drifting
PASM has been standard on the S since introduction of the 997.
#28
I spoke to the boss of my dealership a few days ago about fitting the Fabspeed headers and 200-cell cats to my GTS. He said he'd never in 21 years of working for Porsche and BMW before that ever had a warranty claim turned down because a car was modified, and this included remaps. He said the onus was on the manufacturer to prove that the problem was caused by the modification, and that that's basically impossible to do.
A different question: do we think that the updated PCM might mean there's any chance of a software update for the current one so that it might, like, actually have a clue where traffic is?
A different question: do we think that the updated PCM might mean there's any chance of a software update for the current one so that it might, like, actually have a clue where traffic is?
#29
Question: will there be an x51 powerkit available for these turbo models? I don't see one tickable on the configurator. If so, how much additional power do you suspect will be added? Just curious.
#30
Drifting
I spoke to the boss of my dealership a few days ago about fitting the Fabspeed headers and 200-cell cats to my GTS. He said he'd never in 21 years of working for Porsche and BMW before that ever had a warranty claim turned down because a car was modified, and this included remaps. He said the onus was on the manufacturer to prove that the problem was caused by the modification, and that that's basically impossible to do.
Regardless, it's your car and your money, so each owner should do what he/she wants.
Sorry to the temporary detour of this thread.
Last edited by GSIRM3; 09-07-2015 at 12:44 PM.