tpenta

The latest Excellence magazine has a rather negative article on the evolution of the 911. Among other things, they made the following statement:

"The 911 has become the BMW 5 Series of sports cars -- a product that wallows in past glories; one that has lost direction."

-T

stevepow

Oh man, I hope not. But they are right about the 5er. A really nice sedan, but not really the "Ultimate Driving Machine" anymore. That ended at the e39.

Upside for 997 owners though. I'll probably be looking at a nice CPO'd 2011 997.2 for my next one unless they surprise us. I am sure some bits of the new car will be really nice and compelling, but if it becomes too big and loses the driving feel - well, then what's the point.

So new car buyers, pls order some nice '11s that you'll be willing to part with in a few years.

Fahrer

I did read the article. I believe the next 911 may really be headed in that direction. It will be bigger and probabley smoother (as well as more powerful).

ADias

Chris Harris makes that statement as in his mind he sees a low-optioned GT3 RS but not a heavily optioned NAV/Bose/electrical-seats Carrera. I agree with him, but unfortunately in this forum most people load up their cars with stuff that adds nothing and only detracts from sport driving. That's what's at stake.

1BlinkGone

In my mind, BMW has completely lost direction in each of its historical segments; and I can't say I'd disagree with his assertions about the 911 based on what we're seeing of the 991.

boolala

A larger, more luxurious Carrera is spot on.

Those who want a more visceral experience can opt for the GT2 or GT3 and leave the rest of us alone......

TommyV44

There's not much I've seen about the 991 that makes me optimistic...especially the size.

Tom

p-cardriver

BMW sales have been pretty robust through these changes, so even though I personally would prefer a real 2002tii or e39, or the older M3s up through 2001, the market is telling BMW they are doing the right thing. Same for Porsche.

That may cause me to shift to some other mfgr, if they produce a real sports car, or get an older car and keep it up. But the combination of customer comfort demands and nanny weight (air bags, sensors, data recorders, etc) will push prices up, performance down. Maybe the only way to build a new sports car is to make it less of a road car and more of a track car, like the GT3 variants?

Coochas

I have to say that I struggle with what I feel is right and wrong for Porsche. They clearly have been successful in their efforts to market to a larger fan base. Like it or not, this is necessary for a 'sports car' manufacturer to cut it on a large scale.

It would be nice to see Porsche market something like an Exige which is a wonderful light weight car ready for track right out of the box. Then again, I think such a car would be popular among Rennlisters but would not be setting any sales records with the other 99% of p-car buyers. Cars like the Exige are wonderful but not the best as DDs which is what many Porsche owners want. The Boxster Spyder and Cayman R are nice but not really the same as an Exige IMO.

Personally I found a nice balance by owning more than one p-car. My 997TT has all sorts of unnecessary options but it is a wonderful DD and offers insane performance. I also have a Spec Boxster for track use which is a nice raw visceral experience.

With regards to the upcoming 991 only time will tell. I played around one day looking back on Rennlist for OLD threads when the 997 was coming out (i.e. spy shots of 997 etc etc). A number of these threads showed skepticism toward the upcoming 997. My point is that this might be just a temporal phenomenon and the 991 could end up wonderful. Time will tell.

Alstoy

The cars are growing fater and softer with us.

Tbred911

yet each new version is faster around the track than the previous model...

I think what the key defining attribute of a 911 is that it is ultra refined (more so today than 10 years ago) and can be driven by a mad man ... like a mad man... at the track... it has a duality in nature that is not evident upon first impressions through a casual or even spirited city drive... what most purists would like to see is the characteristic of "rawness" be present for daily use... however porsche is a $$$ company so by evolving the 911 into its variants and offering choice will simply sell more of them... bottom line $$$.

blake

As others have said, I think this is a reflection of where the current market is regarding sports cars and drive by wire capabilities....

Upon reflection, the advent of the 996 was the most dramatic move in evolution to a more "compliant" 911 sportscar, and sales at the beginning of the decade validated this action (though it could be argued that the macroeconomic enviroment in the US contributed to its success in its largest market). And to that end, I also believe it was an important move by Porsche to introduce the "GT" series to the states in 2004 (GT3 launch) to offer a segment of the market (Rennlisters, etc.) a more pure 911 experience without the fat...

As long as Porsche continues to offer GT cars for us "crazies", I will continue to buy Porsches in all forms (Cayenne, Panamera, etc) because I will know that the soul is still there...

My $0.02,
-B

91469972

My wife had a BMW 335 which overall was a nice and basic interior just like my 09 C2S. I went for a test of a 2009 M5 new loaded and was it loaded. Every button, switch, adjustment, gadget on planet earth which most come standard. It was so overwhelming when driving it took away the real sense of driving like your car and surroundings. On top of the fact that getting out of the Porsche and into the M5 it made the M5 feel like a truck. And the 7 speed auto trans was terrible with too much lag between shifts. Most of the 5 series and 7 series are just overrun with electronics so I hope after seeing the new 911 interior they didn't do the same.

Selo

I loved my e39 sport manual, but I have to say I'm also really enjoying my '09 528i sport manual. With the relatively high revving NA straight six and a manual box, I feel it's still pretty close to the original mission of BMW - adequate power, really good handling, and excellent gas mileage. However, I realize that not many e60s were built like this....when I was shopping for this car, I found a fair amount of 535s with a manual but next to none of the 528i's. Also, I drove a 2009 M5 a few days ago and I loved the way it drove - just couldn't deal with getting 11 mpg.
As for the new 5, remains to be seen. It looks pretty darn big in the showroom.

timmp

I think that it's a matter of balance - I owned an Elise for 4 years, and it is a wonderful car when it is doing what it was designed to do (go fast on winding roads), and a PIA when it is not (driving on concrete highways, parking in the city, driving when it's really hot out, or really cold, or wet or...). So as an occasional car, it was great, but not as a daily driver. The 997 is pretty comfortable, pretty quiet, and certainly sporting enough for every day and weekend use. It is more attractive and has a more refined interior than my C6 Corvette had, and doesn't suffer from the gremlins and ether-network of dealers that my Ferrari had. It's faster, and more fun, and better looking than my M3 was (and for me, more comfortable). I agree with another poster when you say that if the 997 was Elise-like it wouldn't sell, as you can see by the sales and resale value of the Lotus mark (and believe me, I love Lotus and want them to proper).

I believe that the 997 is as "exotic" a car as you can have, and drive it daily. Move toward the Ferrari/Lambo/Lotus end of the scale and there are sacrifices that will be acceptable to some, but not the majority of buyers - move toward the M3/Corvette/whatever end of the scale and there are other tradeoffs that have more to do with what you like and can afford, than whether the car is truly practical for daily use. This, I believe, is the fine line that Porsche chooses to walk when designing each generation of 911 variant cars, and failure is very very expensive (remember the 964 years...I do).