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I wonder if some confirmed RS builds who ordered LWB's will be denied ? It that is the case, extremely lame.
The orders will be most likely delayed, not denied. With all the PTS orders, including mine, they have some extra time to sort out the LWB supply chain issue.
I still don't understand how this could happen....
Delay in the GT3 due to the recall, then the RS delayed ~year (plenty of time for Lear to make the shells and padding at least). Then Porsche knew they would be releasing the RS & GT4 at approximately the same time. With plenty of "delay" time to prepare they could have easily stockpiled LWB (at Lear, of course, as P is JIT). Even if the % of RS' and GT3's ordered with buckets is higher than historical rate it still does not explain how they run out of seats at the beginning of RS & GT4 production...I could see a shortage later on, as the early cars use a higher % than expected. Just seems weird.
2) The only way that more can be added is to add additional manufacturing lines and/or facilities and that is not an overnight fix.
And you can bet that Lear will want a new level of order commitments from Porsche to do this…and Porsche is not going to. Thus a long delay, maybe never, of catching up with market demand, at least with current generation Porsches.
I still don't understand how this could happen....
Delay in the GT3 due to the recall, then the RS delayed ~year (plenty of time for Lear to make the shells and padding at least). Then Porsche knew they would be releasing the RS & GT4 at approximately the same time. With plenty of "delay" time to prepare they could have easily stockpiled LWB (at Lear, of course, as P is JIT). Even if the % of RS' and GT3's ordered with buckets is higher than historical rate it still does not explain how they run out of seats at the beginning of RS & GT4 production...I could see a shortage later on, as the early cars use a higher % than expected. Just seems weird.
Bill
I am told that the LWBs were not approved yet by U.S. when engine recall was taking place. They were still in approval process around that time period. LEAR could not stock pile seats at that point because seat design might have needed to be further modified for U.S. approval. Each vehicle must be approved for each safety system variation (seats with airbags fall under "safety systems") on individual basis including GT4 with LWB option. Also, don't forget that LEAR is not just producing seats for Porsche they also have seat order commitments from many other manufacturers that aren't quick production type designs.
I am not sure why Porsche even bother with making LWB an option. I realize they charge an exorbitant amount for them but is it worth the negative reaction from a devoted customer base because of the delays?
Also, one size fits all LWB's really mitigates against their effectiveness. I believe Ferrari offered large, medium and small. This is a vanity purchase and nothing more.
re: A Little History on the background re: LWBs prior to current shortage!
Originally Posted by sccchiii
I am told that the LWBs were not approved yet by U.S. when engine recall was taking place. They were still in approval process around that time period. LEAR could not stock pile seats at that point because seat design might have needed to be further modified for U.S. approval. Each vehicle must be approved for each safety system variation (seats with airbags fall under "safety systems") on individual basis including GT4 with LWB option. Also, don't forget that LEAR is not just producing seats for Porsche they also have seat order commitments from many other manufacturers that aren't quick production type designs.
Good point, sccchiii!
re: "I am told that the LWBs were not approved yet by U.S. when engine recall was taking place. They were still in approval process around that time period."
This topic deserves a bit of further exploration at this time. So for all to fully understand the 'full story' behind the 'Fail' by PAG/PCNA in the LWB option saga, we need to go back in history a bit:
Even in 3/28/2014, we were still discussing it here on this forum. And let me copy what I wrote at the time since it incorporates my thoughts on the subject quite clearly:
You can go directly to the link below and go to the actual post above. If you click on the links I have provided in the above post, it will also take you to the source of that additional information!
so how long will Porsche be able to delay production on the RS waiting for seats ? I mean will they start building them with sofa's even though the buyer ordered LWB's ?
The delay meant that there would be no Euro delivery, and that would have meant waiting till next Spring for it. ( You can't get factory delivery after October).
Its just not worth it to me to hang around until 2016 before I get the car..I have a series of events in Europe ,so will go ahead in September.
If I can order them for subsequent fit (yes, I know,,,expensive) for later in 2016 I will have them fitted then.
I am not sure why Porsche even bother with making LWB an option. I realize they charge an exorbitant amount for them but is it worth the negative reaction from a devoted customer base because of the delays?
Also, one size fits all LWB's really mitigates against their effectiveness. I believe Ferrari offered large, medium and small. This is a vanity purchase and nothing more.
Woah, woah, woah. I'll admit I'm vain, but those seat are much more than vanity purchases. LOL.
Think about it. They are the ONLY OEM seat that gives you street safety with airbag protection while ALSO allowing shoulder AND antisub passthroughs for the use of a 6 point harness. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Ferrari seats do not have anti-sub pass throughs.
I love my buckets and wouldn't want a car spec'd any other way.
Woah, woah, woah. I'll admit I'm vain, but those seat are much more than vanity purchases. LOL.
Think about it. They are the ONLY OEM seat that gives you street safety with airbag protection while ALSO allowing shoulder AND antisub passthroughs for the use of a 6 point harness. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Ferrari seats do not have anti-sub pass throughs.
I love my buckets and wouldn't want a car spec'd any other way.
Think about it. They are the ONLY OEM seat that gives you street safety with airbag protection while ALSO allowing shoulder AND antisub passthroughs for the use of a 6 point harness.
That's right. And proper operation of the weight sensor from the factory for those of us with kids.
Hopefully they sort this out next year. Someday this P11 "option" will actually be an option for most of us! Or they need to design a new bucket seat which Lear or some other partner can actually produce in large volume.
Woah, woah, woah. I'll admit I'm vain, but those seat are much more than vanity purchases. LOL.
Think about it. They are the ONLY OEM seat that gives you street safety with airbag protection while ALSO allowing shoulder AND antisub passthroughs for the use of a 6 point harness. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Ferrari seats do not have anti-sub pass throughs.
I love my buckets and wouldn't want a car spec'd any other way.
Joe, not sure about Ferrari and pass throughs. But LWB's to be effective for track work need to fit right. It may be that the 6 point harness addresses that. That said, since 95% of the car use is off track one must weigh the benefits of spending thousands more for very limited use.
Is it your belief that you are faster in LWB compared to 18 way sport seats? Also, consider this. Porsche builds a track sport car and equips it with 4 or 18 way seats. Why would they do that if they felt they were inadequate for track work?
Depending on one's needs, I could imagine arguments favoring sofas, but this comment comes across as either sour grapes (wasn't able to get buckets) or just plain confused (doesn't understand buckets' purpose and/or utility).
05-29-2015, 01:15 AM
