mooty

in that case lease for him has zero benefit, unless money factor is lower than finance rate, or tax write off is fungibly and aggressively applied.

mrsullivan

very well said mooty... and cannot agree with you more on the write off... the firm I work for has a very large tax business.... and one benefit as a partner is that I get a tax partner to do my taxes every year... they caution against pushing the envelope on the tax write off, so I just have never done it...

in this case, with 1.9 rates or lower, I am not sure anyone can REALLY make the case for a lease... my plan is to finance

ps. I did an in/out trade on the sale of my 2011 so I have a large enough tax credit that my sales tax on this new gt3 will be only a couple thousand $....

mooty

^ well then, you are set ;-)

CAlexio

In the amount of time spent debating or trying to figure out the minutiae of whether one strategy vs another nets more, one can just work a few extra hours or play smart in the market to make up the difference. It's just easier to agonize over these more easily defined "savings", than going out to make a few good but slightly less tangible business decisions in our careers to make up that difference.

Mooty in this thread said it best.. You can't beat the house... If there were an easy triage, the financing companies would have taken advantage of it… Anyway we look at it, we lose… Unless of course we go PTS in which case the value of the car can only go up (wink wink Eduardo)

THE only true decision criterium, is whether you can truly afford the car from an asset perspective. If you have all your obligations taken care of, aka your financial ratios are in the right place… Then financing, leasing, or cash become mental mind ****s you play against your IRR. Anyway, even if you got all the calculations and predictions 100% right, then life just comes along and smack you with a big yellow school bus as you exit the dealership, but you didn't see it because you were busy trying not to scrape your front spoiler because tor dumb *** didn't want to lose money on the apparently worthless front lift option... (Had to say that)... And there goes the value of your whole car… If you're lucky that life doesn't take itself back from you.

i think making fun of fastlaneturbo's spoiler, or trying to figure out who the BHP dealer guy really is (I think it's actually Mike In CA) is a more fun waste of time than "lease vs finance"

Rant over.. Back to pondering my garage.

Mech33

But if the premise is that I sell either at the 3 year mark, don't I have to buy the car at the end of the lease from Porsche first, thus forcing me to pay sales tax on the actual value at the 3 year mark?

At a high level with a lease with up front balloon payment, you are financing the residual, and eventually paying sales tax on the entire amount if you don't turn the car back in.

If you buy up front with balloon payment of the same amount, then the only real difference is the finance rate of the residual portion.

So at the 30,000 foot view to me, the comparison boils down to finance rates. When the cost of lending cash is low, then buy, and when the cost of lease financing is low, then lease.

Serge944

You retain the right to sell the car yourself or trade it in at any moment during the lease. If you do this, you are not liable on the sales tax on the residual value - at least not in California.

mooty

In the amount of time spent debating or trying to figure out the minutiae of whether one strategy vs another nets more, one can just work a few extra hours or play smart in the market to make up the difference.
====> that's too much work. personally i just eat two bowls of instant noodle each day. that will produce enough saving to offset the $ delta. i only feed the kids once a day.


... your obligations taken care of, aka your financial ratios are in the right place… Then financing, leasing, or cash become mental mind ****s you play against your IRR.
====> those in finance are rolling their eye nows. IRR meh..... try NPV.

RCorsa

It always makes me laugh when someone on one of these high end car forums starts ranting with a "if you have to ask, you can't afford it" type attitude. I've been super lucky and done well for myself but as someone who's worked hard and gone from making low five figures to high seven figures I will say I never look down on someone asking a real financial questions with such an attitude. Even though I can afford it, I always try and get the best deal and make the best decision with how to spend my $ on the things I want. I mean who plans a trip and then says to the airline "give me the most expensive ticket (in coach or first), because I don't care what it costs....only fools who typically end up broke in the long run, or people who were never going to fly in the first place....

997s07

Agreed. My philosophy was and still is, necessities first, luxuries second. When you work hard for your money you won't waste it.

mooty

i am pretty sure that we all worked butts off to be able to splurge on one of these useless, fossil fuel consuming, noisy contraptions. but u are absolute correct. but my response is not to belittle or negate a legitimate Q, but rather imply that the question is way too open. the answer to the question so posed would be what you find on consumer report for cars. if you keep car < 3yr, lease it, if not then buy it. but that's just wrong. way too many variables. so much so, that any discussion of such is useless. but if you run enough models of lease vs finance, you will see that true apple apple comparisons produce a very small $ delta. they one starts to wonder if that's time well spent. and even if it is well spent time, the result only works out if your initial intent is held truth. but from the ppl here, you can see patterns clearly that most say this is a keeper, incredible car bah blah then u see them sell sooner than expected.... that messes up the financial model..... it's a question with no real answer unless a specific parameter to that such buyer is set and held...

Serge944

+1 million. I wanted to say the same thing but bit my tongue.

I have a friend who had r8 v10, two 458s, virage, 12c coupe, then a spider, then a 650s spider; all complimented by RS7, S63 Coupe, etc…all in the past couple years. Yes, he has cash….and yes, his first question is always "is there a discount on this car?"

Serge944

I hope you don't consult, because "it depends" and "there are too many variables" aren't responses most clients would accept.

CAlexio

I've got a feeling two different people control Mooty's profile

mrsullivan

this... +1

Manifold

LOL, amazing how many people can readily afford this car and yet be cheap about trying to save a few dollars here and there - including me!