Road Test Drive (Disappointed)
09-20-2014, 03:46 PM
#31
I tend to agree with Chris Harris that for every one porsche customer that does not buy this gt3 for what its become at least two new first time buyers will be attracted to it. That was what porsche was aiming for. He referenced that to the no manual option, but I think it applies overall including the better DDability of the 991 generation. It will turn some off, but attract others.
09-20-2014, 03:52 PM
#32
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I don't think you can spend a morning test driving any car (within limits too) and be able to give more than a "first impression". It's uncommonly rare to be able to judge anything accurately with such limited experience, be it with an electronic device, a first date, or car.
I see plenty of high end Porsches around the Bay Area roads, and rarely is it driven with enough skill to engage the "visceral" senses. More often I see them rev hard and accelerate for about 2-5 seconds and then just stop behind a Prius in the fast lane. Kinda like sex I think, it's all short lived wonderment, only to come crashing down shortly thereafter. But we certainly spend a lot of time talking about it don't we.
I see plenty of high end Porsches around the Bay Area roads, and rarely is it driven with enough skill to engage the "visceral" senses. More often I see them rev hard and accelerate for about 2-5 seconds and then just stop behind a Prius in the fast lane. Kinda like sex I think, it's all short lived wonderment, only to come crashing down shortly thereafter. But we certainly spend a lot of time talking about it don't we.
09-20-2014, 03:55 PM
#33
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I tend to agree with Chris Harris that for every one porsche customer that does not buy this gt3 for what its become at least two new first time buyers will be attracted to it. That was what porsche was aiming for. He referenced that to the no manual option, but I think it applies overall including the better DDability of the 991 generation. It will turn some off, but attract others.
09-20-2014, 04:00 PM
#34
Race Director
This is a great thread, I'll add my 2c.
I'm going into this purchase very aware that I will "waste" this car on the road.. My license is too precious and my abilities too low to even begin to explore it like they do on the road portions of the magazine tests. I'm also aware that a boxster Spyder is probably more fun in daily driving because of it's smaller size, manual tranny, and non ground-scraping ride height.
Knowing all this, the motivation for me is to have an "event" when I get time on weekends to go for. A drive. I want to own something which looks utterly exotic, which for this price range the gt3 fits the bill. I want a car which gives me a sense of occasion when I turn it on.. I don't own multiple sports cars, and haven't owned anything this nice ever... So while for real world events a $50k Porsche would fit, I want the excitement and thrill of the look, sound, and let's admit it, absurdity of this car for the road.
I had the incredible fortune to do a very slow test drive with Mike in CA, and my thoughts were confirmed. On the road. The car was absolutely wasted... I could feel just how much potential there was, but a basic boxster would have probably felt the same. But just knowing what it "could" do, and getting to feel that right suspension, and getting to see it parked... Well, I was sold completely on the insanity. Very grateful to Mike for his trust that day!!!
I do look forward to dipping my toe into a few track days.. But the day that I don't get a heart in throat excitement taking this baby out of the garage.. It's getting sold and money is going back Into the stock market. It's too expensive and too special, to not "feel" special. That and the European delivery trip with my dad are basically my only reasons.
I'm going into this purchase very aware that I will "waste" this car on the road.. My license is too precious and my abilities too low to even begin to explore it like they do on the road portions of the magazine tests. I'm also aware that a boxster Spyder is probably more fun in daily driving because of it's smaller size, manual tranny, and non ground-scraping ride height.
Knowing all this, the motivation for me is to have an "event" when I get time on weekends to go for. A drive. I want to own something which looks utterly exotic, which for this price range the gt3 fits the bill. I want a car which gives me a sense of occasion when I turn it on.. I don't own multiple sports cars, and haven't owned anything this nice ever... So while for real world events a $50k Porsche would fit, I want the excitement and thrill of the look, sound, and let's admit it, absurdity of this car for the road.
I had the incredible fortune to do a very slow test drive with Mike in CA, and my thoughts were confirmed. On the road. The car was absolutely wasted... I could feel just how much potential there was, but a basic boxster would have probably felt the same. But just knowing what it "could" do, and getting to feel that right suspension, and getting to see it parked... Well, I was sold completely on the insanity. Very grateful to Mike for his trust that day!!!
I do look forward to dipping my toe into a few track days.. But the day that I don't get a heart in throat excitement taking this baby out of the garage.. It's getting sold and money is going back Into the stock market. It's too expensive and too special, to not "feel" special. That and the European delivery trip with my dad are basically my only reasons.
09-20-2014, 04:05 PM
#35
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i sort of concur with the OP that for street-legal driving a GT3 is a waste, probably a cayman GTS is the sweet spot (of what is available today), or a booster GTS if you fancy the fresh air around you::
). in fact, now that i have almost concluded the negotiations for a 458 Speciale (part-exchanging my F458 Italia), i often ask myself the question why am i spending all this money when a cayman GTS can give the same road driving thrills. but there is another dimension: i like it a lot when i walk towards my F458, when i look at it, when i get into it and feel it, when i push the start button and hear the engine flare up .....etc...etc...
in this you can replace F458 by GT3 and get to the same conclusion.
in short, ownership is not only about speed, or about the driving thing, it is more comprehensive than that.
the feeling you have when you are in and out of the car.
peter
). in fact, now that i have almost concluded the negotiations for a 458 Speciale (part-exchanging my F458 Italia), i often ask myself the question why am i spending all this money when a cayman GTS can give the same road driving thrills. but there is another dimension: i like it a lot when i walk towards my F458, when i look at it, when i get into it and feel it, when i push the start button and hear the engine flare up .....etc...etc...in this you can replace F458 by GT3 and get to the same conclusion.
in short, ownership is not only about speed, or about the driving thing, it is more comprehensive than that.
the feeling you have when you are in and out of the car.
peter
09-20-2014, 04:08 PM
#36
Three Wheelin'
Thought I would chime in with my opinions. Took the 3 on the track last weekend and left with the opinion that it's not the ideal track car. It was the best looking and most expensive car there and the one everyone wanted. But it was nowhere near the fastest.
Several reasons for this. The track (Cadwell Park, UK) is very tight and twisty, my track experience is low compared to a lot of the other drivers who trailered their cars there. The fastest cars there were caterhams and even a turbo, race-prepped MX-5. On a couple of corners I had the car moving around a bit but on most of the others I was nowhere near the limit because there are very few run-offs. I think it's called the mini Nurburgring! Bottom line is I wasn't prepared to risk a £100k+ car the same way the others were happy to do with their caterhams. Plus they weigh half the amount or less!
Obviously some of these problems go away with a faster track/longer run-offs/more practice.
And on the road the car is not as feelsome or involving as a manual 997. And you can't really drive it on the road fast enough to really test it.
So where does that leave me? I should get a 997 C2S for the road and a dedicated lightweight track car.
However, I still love my GT3. It feels special even at low speeds, I appreciate the engineering (which is absolutely unbeatable at this price - the engine itself is a masterpiece). And above all it is an amazing do-everything car. Probably the perfect road trip car. Probably the perfect sports car.
Several reasons for this. The track (Cadwell Park, UK) is very tight and twisty, my track experience is low compared to a lot of the other drivers who trailered their cars there. The fastest cars there were caterhams and even a turbo, race-prepped MX-5. On a couple of corners I had the car moving around a bit but on most of the others I was nowhere near the limit because there are very few run-offs. I think it's called the mini Nurburgring! Bottom line is I wasn't prepared to risk a £100k+ car the same way the others were happy to do with their caterhams. Plus they weigh half the amount or less!
Obviously some of these problems go away with a faster track/longer run-offs/more practice.
And on the road the car is not as feelsome or involving as a manual 997. And you can't really drive it on the road fast enough to really test it.
So where does that leave me? I should get a 997 C2S for the road and a dedicated lightweight track car.
However, I still love my GT3. It feels special even at low speeds, I appreciate the engineering (which is absolutely unbeatable at this price - the engine itself is a masterpiece). And above all it is an amazing do-everything car. Probably the perfect road trip car. Probably the perfect sports car.
09-20-2014, 04:09 PM
#37
Race Director
I had the incredible fortune to do a very slow test drive with Mike in CA, and my thoughts were confirmed. On the road. The car was absolutely wasted... I could feel just how much potential there was, but a basic boxster would have probably felt the same. But just knowing what it "could" do, and getting to feel that right suspension, and getting to see it parked... Well, I was sold completely on the insanity. Very grateful to Mike for his trust that day!!!
09-20-2014, 04:11 PM
#38
Drifting
This is a great thread, I'll add my 2c.
I'm going into this purchase very aware that I will "waste" this car on the road.. My license is too precious and my abilities too low to even begin to explore it like they do on the road portions of the magazine tests. I'm also aware that a boxster Spyder is probably more fun in daily driving because of it's smaller size, manual tranny, and non ground-scraping ride height.
Knowing all this, the motivation for me is to have an "event" when I get time on weekends to go for. A drive. I want to own something which looks utterly exotic, which for this price range the gt3 fits the bill. I want a car which gives me a sense of occasion when I turn it on.. I don't own multiple sports cars, and haven't owned anything this nice ever... So while for real world events a $50k Porsche would fit, I want the excitement and thrill of the look, sound, and let's admit it, absurdity of this car for the road.
I had the incredible fortune to do a very slow test drive with Mike in CA, and my thoughts were confirmed. On the road. The car was absolutely wasted... I could feel just how much potential there was, but a basic boxster would have probably felt the same. But just knowing what it "could" do, and getting to feel that right suspension, and getting to see it parked... Well, I was sold completely on the insanity. Very grateful to Mike for his trust that day!!!
I do look forward to dipping my toe into a few track days.. But the day that I don't get a heart in throat excitement taking this baby out of the garage.. It's getting sold and money is going back Into the stock market. It's too expensive and too special, to not "feel" special. That and the European delivery trip with my dad are basically my only reasons.
I'm going into this purchase very aware that I will "waste" this car on the road.. My license is too precious and my abilities too low to even begin to explore it like they do on the road portions of the magazine tests. I'm also aware that a boxster Spyder is probably more fun in daily driving because of it's smaller size, manual tranny, and non ground-scraping ride height.
Knowing all this, the motivation for me is to have an "event" when I get time on weekends to go for. A drive. I want to own something which looks utterly exotic, which for this price range the gt3 fits the bill. I want a car which gives me a sense of occasion when I turn it on.. I don't own multiple sports cars, and haven't owned anything this nice ever... So while for real world events a $50k Porsche would fit, I want the excitement and thrill of the look, sound, and let's admit it, absurdity of this car for the road.
I had the incredible fortune to do a very slow test drive with Mike in CA, and my thoughts were confirmed. On the road. The car was absolutely wasted... I could feel just how much potential there was, but a basic boxster would have probably felt the same. But just knowing what it "could" do, and getting to feel that right suspension, and getting to see it parked... Well, I was sold completely on the insanity. Very grateful to Mike for his trust that day!!!
I do look forward to dipping my toe into a few track days.. But the day that I don't get a heart in throat excitement taking this baby out of the garage.. It's getting sold and money is going back Into the stock market. It's too expensive and too special, to not "feel" special. That and the European delivery trip with my dad are basically my only reasons.
I love this. You're my new hero.
09-20-2014, 04:16 PM
#39
Three Wheelin'
Gonna add another thought. My new favourite Porsche Configurator road-driving sports car is a Boxter GTS with sports suspension, LSD, ceramic brakes, manual 6-spd, bucket seats and very little else. Apparently the sports suspension and ceramic brakes give a bit of steering feel back.
Definitely not as good car for the money as a GT3 but would be an awesome road driver I'm sure.
Definitely not as good car for the money as a GT3 but would be an awesome road driver I'm sure.
09-20-2014, 04:16 PM
#40
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I tend to agree with Chris Harris that for every one porsche customer that does not buy this gt3 for what its become at least two new first time buyers will be attracted to it. That was what porsche was aiming for. He referenced that to the no manual option, but I think it applies overall including the better DDability of the 991 generation. It will turn some off, but attract others.
09-20-2014, 04:24 PM
#41
Nordschleife Master
That was my thought. As others have said...I bet if it was broken in and you stayed in lower gears at higher RPM's on the street, your experience would of been different. I have no direct experience opinion as I have not driven the car yet. Other than shift throwing for 997 or 996, I cant see how I wouldn't enjoy this car more on the street and track for that matter. I think the younger you are, the more you would miss the rawer 997 and rawest 996 GT3's. Been there done that so at 52 years of age, I'm ready for a change. More comfort/practicality on the street, faster for the DE's on the track.
09-20-2014, 04:33 PM
#42
Three Wheelin'
I think the OPs first impressions are to be expected. Sometimes we understand a thing intellectually w/o realizing what that means in the real world of experience. There is no way this car could be a tractable street car and yet reveal any of its potential at public road speeds in the United States at least. If driving a standard 991 C2 or C4S is boring at normal street legal speeds, what's left for the GT3? This is not a new observation. Back in early '70s many people (including R&T) thought the 911T a far better choice for day to day driving pleasure than the high strung 911S for similar reasons. People often buy cars like the GT3 or 911S simply because of what they represent and what they are capable of, regardless of whether or not that potential is readily accessible.
09-20-2014, 04:36 PM
#43
Rennlist Member
Curious, what would be the speed in 2nd gear at 8k rpm? 3rd?
09-20-2014, 04:39 PM
#44
Three Wheelin'
Thought I would chime in with my opinions. Took the 3 on the track last weekend and left with the opinion that it's not the ideal track car. It was the best looking and most expensive car there and the one everyone wanted. But it was nowhere near the fastest.
Several reasons for this. The track (Cadwell Park, UK) is very tight and twisty, my track experience is low compared to a lot of the other drivers who trailered their cars there. The fastest cars there were caterhams and even a turbo, race-prepped MX-5. On a couple of corners I had the car moving around a bit but on most of the others I was nowhere near the limit because there are very few run-offs. I think it's called the mini Nurburgring! Bottom line is I wasn't prepared to risk a £100k+ car the same way the others were happy to do with their caterhams. Plus they weigh half the amount or less!
Obviously some of these problems go away with a faster track/longer run-offs/more practice.
And on the road the car is not as feelsome or involving as a manual 997. And you can't really drive it on the road fast enough to really test it.
So where does that leave me? I should get a 997 C2S for the road and a dedicated lightweight track car.
However, I still love my GT3. It feels special even at low speeds, I appreciate the engineering (which is absolutely unbeatable at this price - the engine itself is a masterpiece). And above all it is an amazing do-everything car. Probably the perfect road trip car. Probably the perfect sports car.
Several reasons for this. The track (Cadwell Park, UK) is very tight and twisty, my track experience is low compared to a lot of the other drivers who trailered their cars there. The fastest cars there were caterhams and even a turbo, race-prepped MX-5. On a couple of corners I had the car moving around a bit but on most of the others I was nowhere near the limit because there are very few run-offs. I think it's called the mini Nurburgring! Bottom line is I wasn't prepared to risk a £100k+ car the same way the others were happy to do with their caterhams. Plus they weigh half the amount or less!
Obviously some of these problems go away with a faster track/longer run-offs/more practice.
And on the road the car is not as feelsome or involving as a manual 997. And you can't really drive it on the road fast enough to really test it.
So where does that leave me? I should get a 997 C2S for the road and a dedicated lightweight track car.
However, I still love my GT3. It feels special even at low speeds, I appreciate the engineering (which is absolutely unbeatable at this price - the engine itself is a masterpiece). And above all it is an amazing do-everything car. Probably the perfect road trip car. Probably the perfect sports car.
09-20-2014, 04:40 PM
#45
Rennlist Member
Great thread.
I take the POV that for DD it can't be soft and comfy enough but at no expense of the absolute track fun for which I buy a GT3. I found all previous Gt3 perfectly suitable for puttering around town yacking away on Bluetooth with AC going. I like my MB's better for that with massage vented seats but OK.
So you evaluation is very positive to me. Make it comfy as long as it thrills on track and scares me a little. Don't know how much more boring it will be without heel and toeing but maybe learning left foot braking will make up for it.
The RS wil be a bit more raw.
One car less to keep around, if it can do all well.
I take the POV that for DD it can't be soft and comfy enough but at no expense of the absolute track fun for which I buy a GT3. I found all previous Gt3 perfectly suitable for puttering around town yacking away on Bluetooth with AC going. I like my MB's better for that with massage vented seats but OK.
So you evaluation is very positive to me. Make it comfy as long as it thrills on track and scares me a little. Don't know how much more boring it will be without heel and toeing but maybe learning left foot braking will make up for it.
The RS wil be a bit more raw.
One car less to keep around, if it can do all well.