2015 GT3 misfire engine - help
01-27-2016, 07:49 AM
#31
Three Wheelin'
Sorry to hear about your troubles,but I must say that what these dealer technicians are doing is called swaptronics. They're swapping parts in the hopes that something will fix the problem. That is something a backyard hack would do. I'm amazed at these so called " technicians ". And they go training in Germany on Porsche's dime. I'd be ashamed of myself.
01-27-2016, 07:55 AM
#32
Nordschleife Master
All this swapping is most likely by direction of PCNA tech assistance..right wrong or indifferent the swapping is the new more efficient way of solving problems and I for one am happy for it because it would be a total disaster if they didn't, God knows how many engines would be broken down needlessly for minor problems that didn't require it. I do agree that the diagnosis art has gone bye bye. Basically they are trained but are more like line chefs now then actual chefs creating meals. They are simply wrenches to swap assemblies at direction of the tech center.
01-27-2016, 08:07 AM
#34
Three Wheelin'
Yes it will suck when outside warranty but the issue isn't swapping parts...issue is figuring out real cause of problem quickly because regardless of swapping parts or spending lots on diagnosis labor it's a lose lose for us outside warranty. While our cars are under warranty unfortunately is the real training time for these techs and we all hope that they see enough failures to know in future quickly what is likely the problems so we don't spend endless labor money or parts money for that matter
01-27-2016, 09:08 AM
#35
Nordschleife Master
Yes it will suck when outside warranty but the issue isn't swapping parts...issue is figuring out real cause of problem quickly because regardless of swapping parts or spending lots on diagnosis labor it's a lose lose for us outside warranty. While our cars are under warranty unfortunately is the real training time for these techs and we all hope that they see enough failures to know in future quickly what is likely the problems so we don't spend endless labor money or parts money for that matter
01-27-2016, 10:25 AM
#36
Race Director
To be quite honest; this whole engine crap from the beginning is getting old. There are just only going to replace each engine as they fail hoping those that do not track should not see a failure. I am not a "doom and gloom" guy but I am a realist and, its obvious, they have a real issue with this engine. And there should not be an excuse because this is what they do every day. But, in the end- as long as they continue to replace and improve so let it be. My main concern is when that warranty is up do they look the other way??!!
01-27-2016, 11:06 AM
#40
Three Wheelin'
To be quite honest; this whole engine crap from the beginning is getting old. There are just only going to replace each engine as they fail hoping those that do not track should not see a failure. I am not a "doom and gloom" guy but I am a realist and, its obvious, they have a real issue with this engine. And there should not be an excuse because this is what they do every day. But, in the end- as long as they continue to replace and improve so let it be. My main concern is when that warranty is up do they look the other way??!!
Jimmy,
One thing to realize with the current engine concerns, they have occurred because Porsche took a tried and true engine design, the 9A1 (exact one I had in my 2009 C2S and the same you will have in your GT4), and cranked up the design to the max. To make it special. To add a dry sump oiling system for high G oiling on the track. To get the most out of the N/A 3.8L flat 6. To give the owner a 9,000 rpm experience. And still giving it an industry first track warranty! This is all pushing the envelope. Also, not helping Porsche, is the new motor oils of today. To protect catalytic converters, zinc/phos concentrations are reduced. So now they need to use DLC in the high wear areas. Will this near envelope engine run 100,000 miles? at continuos 9,000rom runs, I doubt it. But, Porsche thought it would. At least their engineers thought it would. Would everyone be happier if they gave the 3.8l motor the reduced rpm software of the RS? After all, it would still reach maximum Hp/torque numbers. What if they limited the car to 8800 Rpm and that alone completely solves the engine problem? Would that be acceptable? I would bet that every single GT4 owner would gladly trade their 9a1 variant for the GT3 motor. Even if the redline was 8,250 rpm. The unfortunate thing for Porsche is that they let the cat out of the bag with the 9,000 rpm engine. And now they are attempting to make sure they save face. In time, we will eventually know what is the issue. And if there is even a fix or not. The history of every engine ever built will always show its weaknesses, eventually. Pick any manufacturer, any engine. There are none without faults. It just so happens that this car was marketed to a group of track enthusiasts, with the track warranty, and the price range was acceptable for this car to get abused on the track, every single 9,000 rpm shift, every single lap. As an F engine owner, I intend to have no worries. Drive it as intended. Fix it when broke.
01-27-2016, 12:19 PM
#41
Burning Brakes
The Sad Fact of Life is that the highly stressed Race Engine that will last indefinitely at close to Maximum power has not been designed yet, and if it ever is, we probably could not afford to buy one. Even the vaunted Mezger Engine that preceded our 9A1 has a similar history, except that most of them were used on the streets in traffic at a small fraction of maximum power and maximum RPM. My own 450 HP rated Engine in my GT2 Race car was only warranted by Porsche for 30 hours total life before overhaul. Mine went 50 hours before blowing holes in pistons. The half dozen 997 GT3RS 4.0 500 HP owners I know that have tracked and/or raced those Engines have all required replacement or rebuilding after similar use hours.
I'm very grateful to Porsche that they are warranting our Engines even with high track use and offer us
replacements if they fail. I don't know any other manufacturer who will do that, nor any other Engine that
has proven to have a longer warranteed lifetime close to max power than our 9A1s.
I'm very grateful to Porsche that they are warranting our Engines even with high track use and offer us
replacements if they fail. I don't know any other manufacturer who will do that, nor any other Engine that
has proven to have a longer warranteed lifetime close to max power than our 9A1s.
01-27-2016, 12:37 PM
#42
Race Director
^Hey, do not get me wrong. I commend Porsche for stepping it up and replacing any engine that may need to be replaced- they better because they could get hit with some Lemon issues. I do not track and this engine might last a lifetime for me but I am glad Macca is documenting this stuff. My issue is that it is obvious they have a problem and when/if they will admit it and when the warranty expires will they leave us pissing in the wind. If the Volkswagen debacle is any indication - I think I know the answer
01-27-2016, 12:44 PM
#43
Race Director
This is just part of the deal with race cars. Watch any race on TV and someone is going to have a catastrophic failure during it. Most likely more than one. I just think it is awesome that Porsche even provides a warranty for this type of car.
01-27-2016, 01:06 PM
#44
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Thanks fairsad. It sounds to me like a coil/plug issue frankly. I would not expect all three cylinders to throw codes same time. Usually one intake side rocker (eg 6 seems popular though 5 also showed wear in mine) shows wear first then starts scoring the cam lobe tip. It only takes a minute tolerance on one rocker/cam lobe to throw the fault code. My best arise is await the techs diagnosis but I think they may have installed a faulty coil pack hopefully...please let us know what they find. If all rockers have failed at the same time at such mileage that would indicate a catastrophic lubrication issue on that bank and to date that hasn't been the pattern but you engine if the first F I heard and at such low mileage I would suspect the cause elsewhere. Ps I am not a mechanic!!
today my porsche center did change the knock sensor from the defective cylinders to other and the issue got messed up now its 1, 4 and 5 misfiring.
next try is manual check the injectors and see what could they find but until now they cant figure out the issue.
01-27-2016, 01:07 PM
#45
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
The following message appears:
"REDUCED ENGINE PERFORMANCE - POSSIBLE TO DRIVE ON"
The car has 7200 miles and the message has appeared 3 times over the past 200 miles. Message only appears on cold startup. Misfire codes on cylinder 3 and 5 diagnosed.
The dealer replaced all coils and spark plugs on the 1st attempt.
The dealer replaced the injectors on 3 and 5 cylinders on 2nd attempt.
The proposed fix for the 3rd attempt is to replace injectors for the remaining cylinders, which will mean that all plugs,coils and injectors would have been replaced. I will advise of the outcome.
"REDUCED ENGINE PERFORMANCE - POSSIBLE TO DRIVE ON"
The car has 7200 miles and the message has appeared 3 times over the past 200 miles. Message only appears on cold startup. Misfire codes on cylinder 3 and 5 diagnosed.
The dealer replaced all coils and spark plugs on the 1st attempt.
The dealer replaced the injectors on 3 and 5 cylinders on 2nd attempt.
The proposed fix for the 3rd attempt is to replace injectors for the remaining cylinders, which will mean that all plugs,coils and injectors would have been replaced. I will advise of the outcome.
which model is yours?
