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Posted on the PTS Reference thread in that 991 gt3 forum. But
perhaps of interest to those in this thread too since it touches on
a conversation I had with 'Porsche Exclusive' executives at my
luncheon with them in Zuffenhausen re: a possible new PAG color,
'Magic Bamboo Metallic'!
***
Originally Posted by Warren99
Saw these pics. PTS on a new turbo already?
Surprised considering how many are still waiting
on PTS RS's.
Originally Posted by bronson7
^^^Any idea what colour?
Originally Posted by lessthan3mph
Could it be--Magic Bamboo Metallic?!!!
Originally Posted by bronson7
Seems like the Magic Bamboo Metallic has a bit of brown in it.
Once again, we know photos are often misleading. Good work
"lessthan3mph"
Originally Posted by lessthan3mph
Ya, I agree, it doesn't look exactly the same, but it would be
hard to imagine they'd do PTS already, since the window for
all PTS should be closed. So I'm guessing a new green that
hasn't been seen before, and magic bamboo might fit the bill.
It's not on the configurator yet, but who knows...
****
Something is going on with this color...and it's not the same
'Magic Bamboo Metallic' that we saw earlier on that Cayenne
or my photos taken at Porsche Leipzig last July.
But it looks like a new color (regardless what they call it) under
consideration for at least the 911 Turbo & perhaps other models!
This is a .2 991 Turbo. Note that the license plate: 'BB*CR 125',
which stands for Böblingen, Baden-Württemberg. Such plate is
often associated with a Weissach test car. So my bet is that this
is a Porsche factory vehicle, not a customer PTS car!
***
Here was a similar Weissach factory gt4 in which 'Miami Blue'
was tested. I personally saw this car at Zuffenhausen during
my visit last July!
***
And here is a different Turbo (with regular 'red' calipers, not PCCBs)
at Weissach as reported by someone recently here in Rennlist. It's
a .1 991 Turbo, so they were experimenting with this green metallic
color for at least one year. Coincidence that these metallic green
turbos are showing up at Weissach or with Weissach area plates,
I don't think so!
Originally Posted by RSGT
Saw this PTS green Turbo (factory car) yesterday in Weissach.
****
And here was my response to the fellow that posted the photo,
although it was never subsequently determined as to the color:
Originally Posted by Z356
Did you get to talk to the owner and find out
the exact PTS color?
It looks too light & rich to be the popular 'Oak Green Metallic'...
And there are many other possibilities of 'green metallic' PTS paints
which we are not that familiar with in their current 991/981 form:
And it could also be a few approved green metallics that are not
listed above! These types of 'metallic' greens were a particular
favorite color of Ferry Porsche!
If you could find out for us, we all would appreciate it!
So keep you eyes on this new metallic green color. It might be
the re-formulated 'Magic Bamboo Metallic' that Daniel is talking
about and that we brought up at my luncheon with 'Porsche
Exclusive' staff back in July at Zuffenhausen. Here is what I
wrote about it back in July after Daniel told me the info he had
found out just before my meeting with 'Porsche Exclusive'!
For the record...
I am almost at my limit of 'angst' with PTS at Porsche. I have contacted
my sources at PAG & PCNA this week over the '3rd Party' PTS painting
rumor first posted by Unotaz & Whoopsy in a 991 gt3 forum thread &
have yet to receive a reply. You can follow the exchange at the link
below:
Hopefully we will get a response & the matter clarified for the record.
In the meantime, I will no longer be involved carrying any further
'water' for Porsche on the PTS topic until I get more cooperation
from those individuals tasked - & paid handsomely - to deal with
their PTS customers (of which I am one) at this corporation, which
last I heard is still a for-profit organization. And I like to remind
all that PTS is a profitable option (recently adjusted up in price to
nearly $7K from $5.5K) regardless the headaches re: its convoluted
logistics at PAG!
Saludos,
Eduardo
Scottsdale, AZ
Thus the following post which I wrote elsewhere at Rennlist:
Originally Posted by secretcollector
Is there a more recent one than July, 2015?
If so, would someone please post a link to it or the PDF?
Thanks!
Originally Posted by bronson7
Might want to send Eduardo a pm.
If anyone would know it would be the King of PTS.
"The 'King', eh? Better than the 'Queen' in this case, I guess.
Gents: The problem is that since July 2015 PAG has categorized
the approved PTS lists 'For Internal Use Only - Confidential'.
I have an even more updated list than Feb 12, 2016 but my copy
doesn't have an exact date. But it has more colors approved than
the Feb 2016 list...so I know it's newer! For example, in it 'Nardo
Grey', the Audi color I chose for my new '16 RS7 (but referred by
Audi as 'Nardo Gray'), has been finally approved for PTS at Porsche!
I am still getting the approved PTS list from my sources inside the
organization but I will not post them in a public forum until I get
permission from Porsche. I have been trying to convince PAG that
it's not in the best interest of their customers, and ultimately PAG,
to hide this list, keep it secret & surround it in 'mystery' once again.
That is the world we lived with during the pre-991 model period
before we started publishing the list & explaining how PTS works
in a series of threads dating back to 2012 here at Rennlist. As a
matter of fact, just four of these threads now have total views
of over one million views...a testament to the popularity of the
subject matter among enthusiasts here at Rennlist! And that
interest has directly translated into record demand for this most
'unique' of options that you can order in a Porsche!
I have made my views known on the 'Confidential' obstacle to the
posting of the approved list to Barbara Boeckenhoff - Manager,
Porsche Exclusive & Personal Design - PCNA, as well as to other
individuals in key positions at both PAG & PCNA. But so far it has
been to no avail. So it's up to all of you, if you want to know the
approved PTS colors & how the PTS windows work, to lobby your
contacts at Porsche & the P-dealers to disseminate this information
& not hold it 'confidential'. The premise of keeping this information
close to the vest is the false assumption that by 'us' not talking about
it too much at places like Rennlist, or allowing the list to be published
in the internet, demand for PTS will go 'down' & be more 'manageable'
for those responsible for planning this 'troublesome' option at the factory.
In the end, PAG will decide what it wants to do...and we either will have
to accept it or shop elsewhere for an alternative brand. I am not going
to send this list to any of you without the approval of PAG, so please
don't ask. So if you want to know about approved PTS colors, you need
to demand a response from PAG, PCNA & your P-dealers. And you can
start by contacting 'Porsche Exclusive' in Atlanta. Even though this group
doesn't actually run PTS in Germany, 'Porsche Exclusive' can be a sounding
board that allows Porsche to hear what you want in regards the PTS program
& option.
Porsche Cars North America, Inc.
Porsche Exclusive - Personal Design Studio
One Porsche Drive
Atlanta, GA 30354
E-Mail: PersonalDesign@porsche.us
So please give it some thought & contact them about this important
topic. Otherwise it will become (once again) the 'exclusive' option
of only those well connected to dealers 'in the know' & assorted VIP's.
And if we return to this 'opaque' world of PTS, the average Porsche
customer will be the principal loser!
So it's up to each & everyone of you to determine the future of this
Paint-to-Sample program. Caveat emptor. You have been warned."
Let us remind folks what all of this means.
Daniel last July was able to see a new hue
added to a list of colors expected to be seen
on Porsche models. This guide is apparently
done by the auto paint companies for the
benefit of auto paint shops (repairs, etc) so
that they they can get information on the
correct color formula for the new paint.
Daniel let us know if this brief explanation
is correct. In any case, after much sleuthing
work, we finally identified the color when it
started showing up in prototype 911 Turbos
at Weissach & other places near Stuttgart!
Now Daniel has spotted another hue on a
similar new Porsche production color list
put out by some auto paint company. But
the weird thing is that the color code in
that directive for 'AventurinGruenMetallic'
is M6T. Well, Porsche currently has a
metallic green in their approved PTS list
called 'AventuraGruenMetallic', but that
has a color code specified as 39S.
And there has been some confusion on the
Porsche color names before, as documented
here:
So the fact that the new color discover by Daniel
is color code MT6 might mean that this is another
head-fake from Porsche to throw us off the color
scent...and the color might turn out to be not
what we are expecting to see (check the 'Aventura/
Aventurine Green' 993 below) considering that it
has a similar color name attached to it!
Just as 'Bamboo Green Metallic' (Y76) (or is it
called 'mambagruenmetallic' ?) turned out to be
quite different from what we originally expected!
I recently posted the following on post #245 on page 17:
Originally Posted by Z356
I am almost at my limit of 'angst' with PTS at Porsche. I have contacted
my sources at PAG & PCNA this week over the '3rd Party' PTS painting
rumor first posted by Unotaz & Whoopsy in a 991 gt3 forum thread &
have yet to receive a reply. You can follow the exchange at the link
below:
Hopefully we will get a response & the matter clarified for the record...
Well, I have the following update on that story. Here is what
I posted today on the 991 gt3 forum:
Originally Posted by Whoopsy
It was seems I was told an incomplete statement at Leipzig
about PTS and I wasn't aware enough to dig deeper, unlike
someone else here who had more of an interest in PTS and
would know to ask more.
That 'someone else' Whoopsy is referring to is me. And there
is a lesson to be learned here at Rennlist about this whole incident.
You can either take 'incomplete' information & run with it. Or you
can be more careful & measured when you post here about PTS.
And please double-check with reliable sources at PAG & PCNA
before posting definitive-sounding statements that could turn
out to be false or misleading. It's up to all of you to decide which
method gives you the most accurate information & serves best
the interest of our forum. The credibility of Rennlist as at risk.
This forum counts on you getting it right & not propagating
false rumors!
*****
Here is the history of this 'incident' for those interested in the
particulars. It all started on this thread back in late April:
Originally Posted by unotaz
True PTS cars are painted in a 3rd party facility.
Originally Posted by Z356
Say what?
Who told you that?
Saludos,
Eduardo
Scottsdale
Originally Posted by Z356
I don't know if you have been following PTS at Porsche closely, but
that particular option has been quite limited for a while now, especially
on the gt3, gt3 RS, gt4 & 981 Spyder.
The 911R will be built in Zuffenhausen & they have the ability to do
PTS on all of these cars right there. Their paint facilities are 'State of
the Art'. It's just a question of logistics re: the strict procedures PAG
follows to allow PTS for their cars & the coordination of the painted
parts (exterior & interior) which come from sub-contractors & outside
vendors. PTS is not a high priority at PAG for the production engineers.
And until it becomes so, these bottlenecks will continue to exist & PTS
will remain 'difficult' to get in certain high-demand models.
But I am curious. What third party painter do you think they would
be sent to? Earl Scheib GmbH in nearby Fellbach?
Saludos,
Eduardo
Scottsdale
Originally Posted by Whoopsy
Sorry Eduardo,
Unotaz is correct.
True PTS are sent off to a 3rd party for all models be
it a Stuttgart production car or Leipzig production car.
That's why the limited capacity. It also takes time to
validate and inspect the finish to pass Porsche's own
standard.
The so called 'fake' PTS like the black, orange and
yellow on the R are painted in house, that part is
correct.
Originally Posted by WSH
Looks like Mr. PTS just got schooled
Originally Posted by Z356
No problem. We are here to learn from each other.
I must tell all of you that this is the first time ever
that I hear that Porsche sends all PTS cars to a third
party for paint. If true, I am really & truly surprised.
As Reagan said, 'trust but verify'. I'll report back when
I get this confirmed as 'fact'.
Saludos,
Eduardo
Scottsdale
Originally Posted by Whoopsy
Don't say that.
Before we always assume PTS cars are all painted
at Porsche's state of the art paint shop that they
'say' can paint any colour.
But now it turns out isn't the case, true PTS cars'
body and panels are send out to third party and
basically hand painted one by one.
I was quite shocked to hear that Friday at the
Leipzig plant.
Originally Posted by unotaz
+1
Eduardo's expertise and contribution on PTS and
exclusive options have been outstanding! I think
I lost count how many times I had used his posts
to spec out my cars!
****
Which leads up to Whoopsy's so-called update yesterday:
Originally Posted by Whoopsy
Anyway, when I stopped by Stuttgart to config my R,
I had new information about PTS. It was seems I was
told an incomplete statement at Leipzig about PTS and
I wasn't aware enough to dig deeper, unlike someone
else here who had more of an interest in PTS and would
know to ask more.
The PTS question was brought up again in Stuttgart, and
the detail was that PTS is done in house in Stuttgart, while
PTS is done by a 3rd party in Leipzig. So the Panamera
and Cayennes gets the 3rd party treatment only.
I was told 'all cars are painted by 3rd party' in Leipzig,
which is correct in the person's point of view as all cars
from 'Leipzig' which is that factory. But not 'all cars' as
in all Porsche cars.
So here is the bottom line. Whoopsy's statement which
he posted on 4/23/2016 which said 'Sorry Eduardo...
True PTS are sent off to a 3rd party for all models be it
a Stuttgart production car or Leipzig production car'
was admittedly false.
And to prevent further confusion (which his original posting
has created ever since!), I feel the need to point out that
the statements made yesterday about 3rd party PTS at Leipzig,
if left unchallenged, will lead to more confusion on the topic,
not less! Let me explain:
I believe that one of Whoopsy's statement yesterday is also
incorrect & misleading. He states that "PTS is done by a 3rd
party in Leipzig. So the Panamera and Cayennes gets the 3rd
party treatment only. I was told 'all cars are painted by
3rd party' in Leipzig, which is correct in the person's point
of view as all cars from 'Leipzig' which is that factory."
This is not so. All Panameras have been welded together
& painted at a VW plant in Hanover since day one for that
model. So all Panameras are painted at Hanover, whether
it's standard color offerings or PTS. To say PTS is done by
a third party is misleading. Similarly, all Cayennes are welded,
painted & partially assembled in Bratislavia, Slovakia at another
VW Group plant. That has been the case since day one of that
model. So any Cayenne that is painted standard colors & those
rare PTS examples are done in Bratislava. The Macan is welded,
painted & assembled almost 100% at Leipzig*. I believe that
PTS Macans are done at Leipzig's state-of-the-art paint facility
& not by a 3rd party. And until they move all 718 Cayman
production to Stuttgart from the VW Group Karmann plant at
Osnabrück (expected in the future), the 981-era Caymans &
even some 981 Boxsters were welded, painted & assembled
at that facility. And that includes Cayman PTS. So to say that
this makes PTS a third party proposition Leipzig's Panamera,
Cayenne or Macan is either false or misleading. PAG doesn't
consider the Hanover, Bratislava & Osnabrück facilities as
'third party' vendors or sub-contractors, as was implied in
Whoopsy's statement.
I contacted Porsche officials after Whoopsy made his grandiose
statements on April 23rd on this forum. They refused to engage
simply because the claim he made of third party PTS was deemed
so wrong it didn't merit a response. Yet here at Rennlist, because
Whoopsy owns a 918 & attends all sorts of 918 events sponsored
by PAG, many assumed he must be 'totally in the know'. Well, that
was not the case this time around. Instead, we all got 'schooled',
or at least taken on a dubious ride, not just 'Mr. PTS'.
You, the reader, must decide what to believe you read on Rennlist
about PTS & consider carefully the sources where that information
is coming from. Also if the person relaying the 'information' has
the experience necessary to understand the larger picture behind
statements bandied about at a PAG event. So caveat emptor.
*Petrol engines are all assembled in Stuttgart. Hybrid/diesel engines
may be put together elsewhere.
When I picked up my car in Stuttgart on June 13, the (charming) tour guide stated that all of the 718's were being built at the Stuttgart factory already.
When I picked up my car in Stuttgart on June 13,
the (charming) tour guide stated that all of the
718's were being built at the Stuttgart factory already.
Yes, Porsche has told us that all 718 production
will be transferred 'soon' to Zuffenhausen. Until
recently, Caymans were being built at Karmann
at Osnabrück. But my understanding was that
some Porsche Cayman production would continue
at Karmann at least until mid-August (summer
vacation factory closing). See press release below:
When I was at the factory one year ago last
July, all 981 Boxsters were already being built
at Zuffenhausen & only Caymans were being
assembled at Osnabrück. The consolidation
of all two door sport cars at Zuffenhausen
is a big deal!
Eduardo, thanks for all your great posts here on Rennlist - I have a quick question - do you know if Sandbeige is a currently approved PTS color and do you have any pictures of a Gold Bronze 911 (else than the China special edition turbo) - considering to paint a new 911 in one of these colors
Eduardo, thanks for all your great posts here on Rennlist -
I have a quick question - do you know if Sandbeige is a
currently approved PTS color and do you have any pictures
of a Gold Bronze 911 (else than the China special edition
turbo) - considering to paint a new 911 in one of these
colors
hets72:
The only 'Sand' colors present on the most recent PTS / PAG approved
list I have seen (April 2016) are:
***
The Porsche 'SandBeige' (color code 6807 or 510) I remember looked
like this circa 1969:
***
On the other hand, the 1970's 'Sahara Beige' (color code 516) has
more yellow tint & looks a lot like the Turbo in your photo:
***
There was a 356A 'Sahara Beige' in 1956, but that looked different than
the 1970's version:
*****************************************
I know very little about the color 'Gold Bronze' Metallic. It would
not be a favorite:
Sébastien in France just posted this in the 981 forum.
It should be an opportunity for one of you in Europe,
or the Middle East, to pick up this unique PTS 'Gulf Blau'
with factory 'Pepita/houndstooth' seat inlays 981 Spyder!
Originally Posted by Targa75
I must unfortunately sale that car next month...
Anyone interested please mail me
I am with the car all summer in the south of France then back in Paris in the first days of september. It is a great car and so exclusive ! Sverdeaux@gmail.com
01-05-2016, 01:07 PM
New upcoming Porsche color???
