Stop Sale?
03-17-2014, 02:29 PM
#2627
Rennlist Member
If a completed but uninstalled engine at the factory undergoes an update, is it 'new' or is it a refurb? What about an installed engine where the car is still at the factory? Or undelivered and at the port?
03-17-2014, 02:35 PM
#2628
Burning Brakes
Well just spoke to my dealer and production is continuing. They confirmed with Porsche that my EU pick up is still on schedule for May 16th. In addition Cyreck who is a rennlist member also confirmed today with his dealer that his US May 9 delivery is on schedule. Porsche is telling folks production is moving forward.
03-17-2014, 02:36 PM
#2629
I think this is a case of a part making the grade during prototype form, then pre-production form, then failing to meet spec once into full scale production.
From my exposure to component suppliers in the auto industry, each jump (from prototype to preproduction/pilot line, then to full scale production) is notable and has attendant engineering hurdles. Sucks that this appears to be the case here.
For those bailing from the car, it's understandable. But I remain in the camp that the fix will be robust.
Long term I have concerns about the top end of the motor since the valvetrain is so new, but I think the bottom end will prove up to the task. Just my gut feel.
From my exposure to component suppliers in the auto industry, each jump (from prototype to preproduction/pilot line, then to full scale production) is notable and has attendant engineering hurdles. Sucks that this appears to be the case here.
For those bailing from the car, it's understandable. But I remain in the camp that the fix will be robust.
Long term I have concerns about the top end of the motor since the valvetrain is so new, but I think the bottom end will prove up to the task. Just my gut feel.
03-17-2014, 02:38 PM
#2630
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I think we should start two new threads
1) compensation thread. I'm afraid for existing owners if the car this is a serious inconvenience. I want to see cash compensation and I think we need to stick together to achieve the best group outcome. In the age if the internet and social media they cant ignore this.
2) in light of the woeful time frames and by way of protest regards the above situation if a satisfactory outcome is not presented by month end we should organise a global "drive your 991 gt3 day" as a protest. Wear your race suit and extinguisher for additional effect! I'm serious!
As previous stated even though the news was firmly told to me 10 days ago I was very disappointed to hear it.
We need a global compensation package for the various scenarios of incomplete ownership including those who have taken delivery and we need to finalise it real soon before Porsche forget what a huge blunder this is!
1) compensation thread. I'm afraid for existing owners if the car this is a serious inconvenience. I want to see cash compensation and I think we need to stick together to achieve the best group outcome. In the age if the internet and social media they cant ignore this.
2) in light of the woeful time frames and by way of protest regards the above situation if a satisfactory outcome is not presented by month end we should organise a global "drive your 991 gt3 day" as a protest. Wear your race suit and extinguisher for additional effect! I'm serious!
As previous stated even though the news was firmly told to me 10 days ago I was very disappointed to hear it.
We need a global compensation package for the various scenarios of incomplete ownership including those who have taken delivery and we need to finalise it real soon before Porsche forget what a huge blunder this is!
I had to cut each track session short last saturday because my substitute car was not up to the heat (not even loaner - the other car I could find - the loaner is utter crap base cayman on all-seasons, which I would not even consider tracking). This is a major pain in the a$$ now. If they make me negotiate with a dealer about compensation instead of writing a check, I'll just have to ask my lawyer to do it for me.
03-17-2014, 02:42 PM
#2631
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On the engine swap note... One time I was talking to my mechanic at the dealer, they had a car 997 in that had a warranty engine swap going on. I thought it was interesting that Porsche has them drop the motor with all of the ancillary parts and just ship it back as a unit. The new engine was sitting there with all new ancillary parts as well and they just put it right back in. Basically everything was new. So I don't see a swap as a bad thing. I would want a some sort of compensation for down time though. They had some issues with early PDK's where they just swapped them out and the broken ones were shipped back as well. I do feel for all of you who already have the cars and have to go through this.
On another note. Does anyone know how many GT3 engines they produce a day?
On another note. Does anyone know how many GT3 engines they produce a day?
03-17-2014, 02:43 PM
#2632
Instructor
Same with me. Just talked to dealer and I am showing April 11 exit production and May 9 arrive at NJ port. It would seem strange to me that they are not putting the fixed piston rod screws in these builds. It would seem to me that these cars will have the new motors in them. Makes no sense for me to cancel my car.
03-17-2014, 02:45 PM
#2633
I think we should start two new threads
1) compensation thread. I'm afraid for existing owners if the car this is a serious inconvenience. I want to see cash compensation and I think we need to stick together to achieve the best group outcome. In the age if the internet and social media they cant ignore this.
2) in light of the woeful time frames and by way of protest regards the above situation if a satisfactory outcome is not presented by month end we should organise a global "drive your 991 gt3 day" as a protest. Wear your race suit and extinguisher for additional effect! I'm serious!
As previous stated even though the news was firmly told to me 10 days ago I was very disappointed to hear it.
We need a global compensation package for the various scenarios of incomplete ownership including those who have taken delivery and we need to finalise it real soon before Porsche forget what a huge blunder this is!
1) compensation thread. I'm afraid for existing owners if the car this is a serious inconvenience. I want to see cash compensation and I think we need to stick together to achieve the best group outcome. In the age if the internet and social media they cant ignore this.
2) in light of the woeful time frames and by way of protest regards the above situation if a satisfactory outcome is not presented by month end we should organise a global "drive your 991 gt3 day" as a protest. Wear your race suit and extinguisher for additional effect! I'm serious!
As previous stated even though the news was firmly told to me 10 days ago I was very disappointed to hear it.
We need a global compensation package for the various scenarios of incomplete ownership including those who have taken delivery and we need to finalise it real soon before Porsche forget what a huge blunder this is!
However, I think (as you are proposing) a concerted effort by us aficionados of an "elite" performance car negotiate compensation package best approach. It appears in PAG's interest to do their best to keep their most educated and expert customer base loyal ...
03-17-2014, 02:47 PM
#2634
I think we should start two new threads
compensation thread. I'm afraid for existing owners if the car this is a serious inconvenience. I want to see cash compensation and I think we need to stick together to achieve the best group outcome. In the age if the internet and social media they cant ignore this.
We need a global compensation package for the various scenarios of incomplete ownership including those who have taken delivery and we need to finalise it real soon before Porsche forget what a huge blunder this is!
compensation thread. I'm afraid for existing owners if the car this is a serious inconvenience. I want to see cash compensation and I think we need to stick together to achieve the best group outcome. In the age if the internet and social media they cant ignore this.
We need a global compensation package for the various scenarios of incomplete ownership including those who have taken delivery and we need to finalise it real soon before Porsche forget what a huge blunder this is!
03-17-2014, 02:52 PM
#2635
Well just spoke to my dealer and production is continuing. They confirmed with Porsche that my EU pick up is still on schedule for May 16th. In addition Cyreck who is a rennlist member also confirmed today with his dealer that his US May 9 delivery is on schedule. Porsche is telling folks production is moving forward.
03-17-2014, 02:55 PM
#2636
Some details just make no sense (big surprise...). Why on earth would they keep producing cars with the issue? I understand clearing the cars currently on the line--but that could have been done already. Why slate production for this and upcoming weeks, only to swap the engine on those new cars later? Either they are much further along in the replacement part / engine process than they are letting on OR the cars due for imminent production will have the fix incorporated already.
(Pure conjecture on my part, using logic...which is likely my downfall.)
(Pure conjecture on my part, using logic...which is likely my downfall.)
03-17-2014, 02:59 PM
#2637
Likely they presume the fix is going to work and producing cars with the fix already installed, await the testing for actual sale and that should minimize the delays......if the fix actually passes their endurance tests. That's what seems to make sense.....I think??
03-17-2014, 03:02 PM
#2638
Instructor
1. To get paid. This issue must be killing PAG financially.
2. To clear orders from the line which is always needed for future models.
There will be a process in place for engine replacement so that is the lesser of two evils.
03-17-2014, 03:04 PM
#2639
Burning Brakes
If the new motor isn't signed off, your car will ship with the old motor - obviously. This will continue for as many months as it takes for the current testing to conclude. Since no timeline has been given, it could be several months before new cars are getting the new engine on the production line. The key announcement to wait for is the one that new engines are now being built. The first engines will go to existing cars so it might take a while for new builds to get new engines.
03-17-2014, 03:04 PM
#2640
Some details just make no sense (big surprise...). Why on earth would they keep producing cars with the issue? I understand clearing the cars currently on the line--but that could have been done already. Why slate production for this and upcoming weeks, only to swap the engine on those new cars later? Either they are much further along in the replacement part / engine process than they are letting on OR the cars due for imminent production will have the fix incorporated already.
(Pure conjecture on my part, using logic...which is likely my downfall.)
(Pure conjecture on my part, using logic...which is likely my downfall.)