718 Spyder release date?
11-30-2016, 06:37 PM
#16
Burning Brakes
How much of this is ultimately a function of CAFE standards? I guess in the big scheme of things, the number of GT cars Porsche sells as a percentage of the total is small, so they could maintain the flat six in a specific product line if they wanted to, particularly with the E concept coming out and not have much of an impact on fleet fuel economy. From what I read the turbo 4 doesn't get that much better fuel economy, but maybe better emissions statistics.
I guess I'm conflicted. On one hand I hope they continue to make the NA GT4 and Spyder, so others can enjoy what many of us have. On the other hand, if they go to the turbo 4, it may make the current GT4 and Spyder more valued.
At the end of the day, no way to know now what they might do. Seems like the trend is to consolidate platforms, and with the 911 and 718 being turbo 4's, would they continue to support a NA six for a relatively small number of GT cars (maybe if the price point was higher?). Seems that Porsche may have been surprised by the demand for the GT4, therefore ultimately making more than they originally thought. They then let a unicorn out (911R), angering those who would buy one but can't, but ultimately setting the stage for strong demand for a manual GT3 RS, which may be snapped up quickly.
I have a suggestion. They should just ask us directly what we want and what we would buy, and then they should go away and build it....(LOL)
I guess I'm conflicted. On one hand I hope they continue to make the NA GT4 and Spyder, so others can enjoy what many of us have. On the other hand, if they go to the turbo 4, it may make the current GT4 and Spyder more valued.
At the end of the day, no way to know now what they might do. Seems like the trend is to consolidate platforms, and with the 911 and 718 being turbo 4's, would they continue to support a NA six for a relatively small number of GT cars (maybe if the price point was higher?). Seems that Porsche may have been surprised by the demand for the GT4, therefore ultimately making more than they originally thought. They then let a unicorn out (911R), angering those who would buy one but can't, but ultimately setting the stage for strong demand for a manual GT3 RS, which may be snapped up quickly.
I have a suggestion. They should just ask us directly what we want and what we would buy, and then they should go away and build it....(LOL)
11-30-2016, 06:57 PM
#17
My guess is that if the next Spyder is branded 718 it will be turbo for the aforementioned marketing reasons, but if it's called a GT4 Spyder it could be NA because, y'know, motorsport.
12-01-2016, 02:29 PM
#18
Burning Brakes
Consider that Porsche sells more 911s, Panameras, and 6cyl SUVs than 4 cyl Boxster/Caymans, none of it has to do with CAFE standards. It's entirely based on creating a wider separation between Boxster/Cayman and the 911.
12-01-2016, 07:31 PM
#19
Not true. Every single vehicle matters when it comes to meeting the every tightening fuel regs. One model can make or break a manufacturer meeting the requirements.
12-01-2016, 07:37 PM
#20
Race Director
Originally Posted by DBH
Porsche has stated that they will not (no promises here!) put a turbo in their GT cars (GT2??). So we might expect a GT4 with a 3.8 six tuned to 400+ hp. The Spyder was never considered a "GT" car so I'd expect a turbo four with 385 +/- hp.
Hey, my guess is as good as anyone's!!
Hey, my guess is as good as anyone's!!
What NA engine could porsche put in the next gt4/spyder?.. they have stopped producing any NA engines except for the gt3 RS 4.0, which even if it goes into the next GT3 as we expect, can't be the same engine they put into their mid-engine car. How could Porsche take any route except to do same thing as BMW did with m3-m2.. turbo engine turned down a notch.
12-01-2016, 09:37 PM
#21
Three Wheelin'
What NA engine could porsche put in the next gt4/spyder?.. they have stopped producing any NA engines except for the gt3 RS 4.0, which even if it goes into the next GT3 as we expect, can't be the same engine they put into their mid-engine car. How could Porsche take any route except to do same thing as BMW did with m3-m2.. turbo engine turned down a notch.
I'm sure they could find a few of 3.8 motors in inventory somewhere. Or, even better, detune a 4.0 to do the job.
12-03-2016, 01:15 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
Cayman/Boxster represented 8% of Nov 2016 US sales. I very much doubt that makes or breaks Porsche in meeting CAFE requirements. More likely the minimal CAFE fines are included in the MSRP. Logically, if Porsche would sell only 4-cyl Macans which is 37% off last month's sales to reduce their fleet emission numbers. Even Porsche stated directly that marketing dictated a 4-cyl for the 718 to separate it from the 911.
12-03-2016, 03:43 PM
#23
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Being "last" = value retention as we have seen most recently with 1997-98 993's, particularly C2S wide-body cars with manual transmissions.
12-03-2016, 04:02 PM
#24
Banned
12-03-2016, 04:05 PM
#25
Banned
Cayman/Boxster represented 8% of Nov 2016 US sales. I very much doubt that makes or breaks Porsche in meeting CAFE requirements. More likely the minimal CAFE fines are included in the MSRP. Logically, if Porsche would sell only 4-cyl Macans which is 37% off last month's sales to reduce their fleet emission numbers. Even Porsche stated directly that marketing dictated a 4-cyl for the 718 to separate it from the 911.
12-03-2016, 07:13 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
The GT cars make up a small portion of Porsche's overall sales. I doubt this decision will ultimately come down to CAFE standards.
This will be an issue of $$$$. The Spyder and GT4 do not use bespoke motors. At the end of the day, they are "parts bin exercises". From a $$ standpoint, it doesn't make sense for Porsche to continue making the 3.8 solely for the Spyder and GT4 when they have a perfectly (objectively speaking) good turbo-4 motor used in the rest of the 718 line, or 3.0 use in the 991.2's. They wouldn't have to go through the expense of significant R&D for a new motor. I also don't believe it would make sense for them to continue producing the 3.8 specifically for these cars. It would increase their overall costs for the car as parts costs would most likely increase due to lower volume....and Porsche could get away with this because these cars never had a bespoke motor in the first place (read: they could get away with it, vs. GT3).
Personally, I believe it will use the either the 3.0tt, or a tooled turbo-4 (don't know displacement) from the 718....but I still think there is a possibility, though unlikely IMO, that the car could receive a detuned version of the 991.2 GT3's motor.
Just my .02.
12-04-2016, 04:08 AM
#30
Race Director
Originally Posted by tcsracing1
NA 991.1 3.8L X51 GTS motor would be nice.