Spyerx

Ugh.

Compare the amp draw left/right and see if they are similar. if high, then something is getting jammed, could be the scissor mechanism.

Frustrating

GeorgeK

It is already the 2nd scissor in the car. I still have the original, that shows no obvious defect. It is not bent, pivots freely and has no undue wear on the teeth. The one in the car is in excellent visual condition, and from a low-mileage car.

My main diagnostic hurdle is that the exact same issue pops up with 3 motors, 2 scissors, all of which show no discernible fault. I'll buy a new motor (475$, ouch!) in a minute if I was positive it is my culprit.

Spyerx

When you say you replaced the motor you replaced the entire assembly correct? Not just the motor itself?

Try the amp test when it's running. if you get higher draw there, something is off.

GeorgeK

Will do, but likely not today, no time left.
Would you mind explaining what I should measure?

Yes replaced the entire assembly. Did not know you can get the motor alone.

Edit: If there is too much draw, shouldn't the fuse blow?

Spyerx

use a voltmeter that can measure amperage. yours can, just move the red cable to the A plug and turn that dial all the way clockwise
maybe easiest is the window fuse
hook up multimeter and cables / settings for DC amps
pull fuse, put + / - on either side of the fuse, operate window, measure values
Alternately you could pull the + lead off the motor and do it there but access could be harder. But more accurate.
You'll need a helper

Any electrical gurus correct me if I'm wrong, I know enough to be dangerous :-)

neanicu

Unfortunately,you did not follow my advice. If you disconnect the motor and give it an alternate 12V power source,you have eliminated wiring/switch...everything. If it works every time with alternate power,the problem is not the motor. If it does the same thing and gets stuck,it's the motor and/or assembly. Done.

GeorgeK

Nicu,
If I have full voltage at the motor, and yet the window is stuck, what do I diagnose by using an alternate source?
I will give it a shot next time it gets stuck.

neanicu

Having full voltage doesn't eliminate amperage draw. Eliminating the car's harness tells you if the problem is the motor.

GeorgeK

Today's update:
I picked the car up and drove it home, while cycling the window the whole way. Over 50 cycles. Not stuck.

I don't know what might have solved it - if it is indeed solved - , but 2 things come to mind: moving the travel limiter, or changing the motor to the old one (which did also get stuck).

Cautiously trying to be optimistic, since the last few days I never got more than 10 cycles before getting stuck, and now I am over 100.

I'll still measure draw tomorrow, and try an alternate power source.

A8KED

I'm not an electrician, but from reading this thread I think there is something you may have overlooked. Does the window always work with the engine running?

From what I can see in the photos you posted with the engine off you have less than 12V (11.81), and with the engine running (Alt. Spinning) you have 13.6+V. It is my understanding that a 12V battery is basically dead at 12V and a good new 12V battery should have around 13.5 to 13.8V at rest. To correctly charge a 12V battery your alt. must put out up to 14V, which your tests seem to indicate it is trying to do.

You may want to replace your battery. It may be that you are experiencing a low voltage situation when operating the windows with the engine off. I work in an industry that uses lots of 12v motors and low voltage is an electric motors worst enemy next to water.

Just my 1 cent.
Kevin

GeorgeK

Engine on or off, no difference, I know the battery is not the freshest.

Today while working on the car (see CV thread) I cycled the window a good 30+ times. Not stuck.

J richard

You said you played "switcheroo" with the switches, but did you replace them with new ones? It's a basic and common failure and one bad switch on either side will cause this problem, and it's not uncommon to have two go out...

GeorgeK

I have never put a new switch in the car. I do have about 6 or 7 switches total, and have tried every combination. I never could get a malfunction on the passenger side (all switches work for the right window, every time).

I have slowed down because of the driveshaft fiasco (see other thread, hard to spend time on a window when the car is on 3 legs and there is CV grease all over the workbench....). Plus work has got in the way this week.

However I tried about 20 cycles of the driver side window yesterday evening and this morning, still not stuck.

J richard

I would replace your switches, it is most likely the source of your problems. You probably have an intermittent switch or connector. Most other prices of the system are bulletproof.

GeorgeK

Respectfully disagree.
I have swapped switches for weeks at a time, and could NEVER have the fault on any other location than the driver side window.
I have a hard time believing that all (6-7) switches that I own have the same defect, and that it only shows up on the driver side window.

What's more, as stated before, when the window is stuck, the switch still sends current to the motor.