911Jetta

As I build the ultimate 964 (in my head), I think of all the usual engine, suspension and interior upgrades. This forum is full of inspirational ideas, but one thing I haven't seen very often, at least in a 964, is a trunk mounted oil cooler. In the end I'm sure it's very expensive and might not be that much benefit, but we are talking ultimate 964 here. I'd love to learn more about this...

Reducing weight is great, but shifting weight forward is also a benefit, especially if your ultimate 964 already has carbon fenders and hood, no spare tire, and a lightweight battery. How much weight could be moved forward if this was done? Could it be as much as 20-40 lbs?

- It would require a new gas tank, that would be designed to split the space with the new oil cooler. (is the stock gas tank heavy also, therefore an aluminum race-type tank would also save weight?)
- How much does the oil tank weigh? 20 lbs?
- Tank holds 5+ quarts of oil? 10 lbs?
- Is moving the thermostat difficult?
- How difficult is it to reroute the oil lines? How much weight is added?

Some inspiration from pre-964 cars.



Maybe it would look something like this (rough pic)

KaiB

Love it.

Perhaps Weiner will pop up and address this - wager he's been there done that.

911Jetta

Built by Andial!




Here's some interesting information:

(text from hoeingmotoren)

I've been having a real good conversation with XXXXXX in which we exchanged ideas for hot rod Porsche projects. We also talked about trunk mounted oil tanks, but neither one of us had anything to do with these so far. Looking for info about it on the web I came across this picture of a really neat setup, obviously built by Andial. Since I know the fine people at Andial, I decided to give them a call and see what they could tell me. I talked to Dieter, and what he told me was not exactly a how-to, but nonetheless very useful information. Thought I'd share it with you:

Be aware of the relative height of tank-out vs. engine-in, be generous with the diameter of the supply (suction) line, use stock diameters on pressure lines. When fabricating the tank put vertical baffles in the bottom and a horizontal baffle between max oil level and the oil return. The return into tank should be at an angle pointing towards the inside wall.

By the way, the car in the above picture started out as a 1969 912 and matured into, well, something different. The oil tank is a 935 part. I have no further details on the car, but it sure looks slightly more exciting than a stock 912.

robt964

This is something I had been thinking about also. I was put off in the end by the plumbing. With the stock induction system there are so many pipes and breathers that running all these down the center tunnel would be fairly unmanagable. I image the cars in your pictures have anything but stock induction so the installation is quite probably much cleaner.

Gus

Have been looking at same - I don't see an issue with running the lines , as you already have two lines that go to the front any way, oil cooler. Think adding a rear breather tank would take care of most of the other lines that go to the tank and you can do away with the oil filler line and the oil level tube. The biggest question is - for a street car is can you put the oil tank in the front and still have room for the spare and enough gas to make trips reasonable. One of the biggest advantages I see would be to totally rework the front boot area to get the fuel tank and oil tank as low as possible.
But you would need to keep the spare and have a reasonable sized fuel tank - you may be able to reduce the capacity of the oil take some - but to me all this would have to be custom made . My front space is already limited as I have installed an electric steering pump in the boot - but I can still carry my spare.

911Jetta

You bring up a good point about the spare tire... personally, I'd ditch the tire.

My "ultimate 964 frunk" would have:
- 5.5 lb Voltphreaks VPH 750 battery (link to 997GT3 thread)
- Porsche Motorsport GT3 electric power steering
- Oil tank
- Lightweight fuel tank
- 935 Style Chassis Strut Brace (X-style)... if even needed with the 964 shell?
- Rothsport hood prop rod


Since you want to keep your spare tire... look at this setup! Wow.

911Jetta

from a 914, but lots of good stuff here:


1972 Porsche 916 (914 conversion)
Chassis #4732917538

911Jetta

All in the name of moving as much weight forward as you can.


No frunk oil tank, but I have to look and stare when I see Motons and a power steering pump.


Very serious!




Even the little version looks cool!

911Jetta

I guess you'd start with a new gas tank, and something like a dry sump oil tank like this:


Dry Sump Oil Tank Assembly |
4 Gallon / 16 Quart (15.14 Liters) - Single scavenge inlet / Dual breather
AN-12 female inlet / AN-16 female feed outlet (On bottom)
19" Tall x 9" Dia. - Aluminum with internal baffling - PETERSON FLUID SYSTEMS

And a whole bunch of small parts: http://www.patrickmotorsports.com/ca...nt-tank-setup/

911Jetta

Let's move some weight up front. I have frunk mounted oil cooler on the brain today...

trendo

I have never thought about relocating the oil tank,but think its cool. It may be more feasible to move a fuel cell into the spare tire well. It would put 70 lbs or so a few feet forward and also a bit lower. It also makes a gas tank your crumple zone....depends on how concerned you are about safety.

Gus

Ok, have thought about it - and looked at oil tanks , but could never find one that I was happy with. Also have looked at fuel cells, but not sure which way to go as a small one that fits where the spare tire went does not hold enough gas. So you need a little taller fuel cell that can hold 15 gals or so.
Following.

QUOTE=trendo;11678261]I have never thought about relocating the oil tank,but think its cool. It may be more feasible to move a fuel cell into the spare tire well. It would put 70 lbs or so a few feet forward and also a bit lower. It also makes a gas tank your crumple zone....depends on how concerned you are about safety.[/QUOTE]

Gus

Need some good pictures of what 964 owners have done to their car in moving oil tank and modifying gas tank/location.

Captain Ahab Jr.

great photos, thanks

Stock fuel tank is surprisingly light as it is made from blow moulded plastic so for size for size probably lighter than an aluminium one.

I have a few plans for my frunk and a front oil tank is one of them.

Also going to add an additional fuel tank but in the area under the original fuel tank on the underside of the car that is taken up by the brake servo. I'll use the extra volume to lower the centre of gravity of the fuel when creating my new composite fuel tank, also will help create room for the oil tank and find space to move the battery over the front axle.

Don't think the 934 cross bracing would add much to the party as the forward mounting points for the front suspension are only just in front of the fuel tank.

911Jetta

Project car at SVP (1982 911 bodyshell)

".... Under the bonnet, there’s a 60-litre ATL fuel cell, twin Red Top low-pressure fuel pumps to swirl pot, with a Bosch high-pressure supply pump and the obligatory pressure-regulating valve.

The front mounted oil tank holds 17 litres, with Dash 12 connections for supply and return, and a breather connection. All plumbed via the thermostat and large front-mounted oil cooler."