mnotz

Hi all!

Yes, another one of these countless no-start posts. But I just got out from under the hood and it's just a tad hot out there. I am SO ready for construction of my nicely air conditioned and heated shop behind the house to begin, but planning and zoning approval processes can be a pain.

Drove the car last about a week ago. No issues whatsoever, sings along perfectly as always. Parked it. Got in the car yesterday morning, car cranks, but no start. Didn't have time to check for anything, left in another car.

Tonight I checked the obvious things - fuel pump relay, is fine, put a known good one anyways, no difference, jumped it, pump runs, plenty of fuel in the pipes (or at least so I think after cracking one open and checking flow).

Put a noid light on a few injector plugs - pulsing nicely.

Injector grounds - look good, cleaned/tightened anyways.

Checked a couple plugs with a spark tester - pulsing nicely.

Pulled a couple plugs - beautiful light brown color, bone dry.

Made sure there is a timing belt - check, there! :P (Was only done 5k ago...)

So, now where to go? The thing that bugs me a little is that the plugs are dry and there is no fuel smell from the exhaust after all that cranking! I heard about a short taking out all injectors at once, but hmmmmm...seems weird for that to happen just from sitting...

Anyone having any ideas?

TIA,
Marcus

joejoe

Did you check the infamous 'green' wire? Pain to change, but necessary if never done.

Mrmerlin

spray some ether into the intake and crank it if it fires then your missing fuel.
is the car a USA or Euro

mnotz

Good next step - agreed. Guess the heat was drying out my brain a bit, but then again, at that point I just wanted to get inside Will do tomorrow and report back It's a US car by the way.

Thank you, Stan!

mnotz

Really not that much of a pain to change, but it's in good order - probably should be changed anyways at some point. However, without that green wire no reference signal for the ignition, and spark seems in order...

Mrmerlin

relay XVI is probably bad fuel injection,
if not then swap the fuel pump relay.
NOTE make sure the relay pins have not pushed the connectors out on the back side of the panel,
a good flashlight will show you.

NOTE the same thing can happen to the connector blocks along the bottom of the CE panel if the connectors are put on the wrong right way then the males can pus the connectors out of the connector housings a careful examination will show you any unseated wires

Also make sure the power for the fuel pump is coming and going on the back of the CE panels where they plug into the fuse pins Deoxit 100 works well here

mnotz

But if relay XVI would be bad, would I still have good injector pulse?

I did swap the fuel pump relay with a known good one, and fuel pump is definitely running (but did neither a real volume test or hooked up a pressure gauge yet!)

Panel was removed and "de-ox'd" just in the beginning of the season, car was worry-free every since, but you never know. I'll definitely take a closer look!

Thanks again Stan!

Mrmerlin

the relay may be good but it could have pushed a wire out of the housing look closely

also check the computer connector under the hot post take it off the computer examine for corrosion

mnotz

Will do! Hope I get to it after work tonight, although I have to drive down to the city, so not sure how it works out, but if not, tomorrow morning definitely!

Thanks again!!!

GlenL

So you've got spark plugs firing, injectors firing and fuel pressure in the rails? I'd re-check everything and make sure the fuel pump is running. Then apply timing light to verify spark.

If everything is good, then give it a try with some starting fluid shot through the AFM. Some say this is heresy and can make bad juju happen but it'll verify that ignition is actually working (or re-re-verify it) and you can focus on the fuel supply. If it does nothing, not even a mis-fire, with the starting fluid then the ignition system is bad.

docmirror

I'm one of those opponents of any kind of starting fluid in the intake. Much safer to use simple carb cleaner. Cheaper too. For best results, begin cranking, then spritz the carb cleaner in short bursts as the engine is cranking. You run the best chance of proper stoich as the carb cleaner is run through the intakes and into the cyls.

Wisconsin Joe

^This. Starting Fluid is usually ether. Very, very potent. Spray too much and the whole car goes "BOOM!!! I know guys who took heads off of aluminum blocks with it (not all the way, but far enough).

FWIW, I drive semi, and if I get caught with ether starting fluid in the truck, I can lose my job.

Carb cleaner does the job just fine, seeing as all you are doing is seeing if there's spark to light it off.

And agreed on getting the engine turning over with the starter, then short "spritzes" into the air cleaner housing (take off one of the tubes).

mnotz

Only had a few minutes today so far, more time tomorrow, but tried some carb clean, even held the fuel door open a tad while cranking and spraying a little inside. Nothing. Even tried a small shot of ether, same nothing. Hooked up the spark tester to 3 other plugs, flashing just fine. But why in the world not even a cough?

Didn't have a chance to go through the CE panel, but I quickly took a screw driver and I am pretty sure I can even hear injectors tick. Fuel pump runs. Plugs seem to have pulse to fire. Maybe a bad coil or module not supplying enough power? I have to put a plug and see if it actually has a solid spark, or if it's just enough to flash the tester.

Just weird that from one day to the next it went from driving perfectly fine, parking it, and then no start.

Thanks so much for everyone's input! I really appreciate it!

Marcus

docmirror

Yeah, I'm going with weak spark. This is a single dist engine I believe? I'd be looking for a carbon path, crack in dist/rotor, cracked coil, poor ign amp, wiring fault. Something that will make the blinky work but won't spark under compression in the cyl. Get out there after dark, real, real dark. Turn off all lights, disable the int lights so there's no light out. Wait 10 min for your eyes to adjust then while you watch the engine carefully, have someone else crank it with a full batt. Might see where things are going if it's a high tension fault.

mnotz

Yea, at this point weak spark is my best guess as well...

I hope to find some time tomorrow, but won't be at night until, well, tomorrow night. I have new cap, rotor, and a known working ignition module and coil on the shelf, so I could start throwing parts at it. I'll check if it's producing a good, bright spark first though. The battery is new this season, but I will throw it on the charger for a while because I am sure all the cranking over the last couple days drained it down quite some.