Alan

Yes - my son's VW Golf TDi has the same remote - his key is smaller than a Porsche key though (length & blade thickness. It may be possible to find a way to get Porsche flipper blanks - but probably not for long (alarm) keys - See below.

As to how easy to repurpose those remotes - not sure of compatibility of learning these keys with an aftermarket system - but at least the VW TDi remote has lock/unlock & hatch (unlock) so it has the functions needed. Could always rip out the whole KE/Alarm system from a VW I suppose...

Below photos. My new keyhead remote key has ~1mm shorter blade length than the stock key, this doesn't leave much margin - it goes in deep to the ignition switch. The VW Key is ~8mm shorter than the long Porsche key.

The full Porsche long key blade wouldn't fit in the closed flip position (short key probably would) - it is of course ~8mm too long

If you shortened the key to fit the flipper it would be ~9mm shorter than the stock key - too short to work in the ignition by ~5mm at least I think.

Are there longer flipper remotes?

Alan

yardpro

any input on us poor schmucks with pre 90 cars?

Alan

It should work on all electric central lock cars ('80-'89) - though you may possibly need to use the pneumatic lock mode to allow for longer lock/unlock pulses.

The only things that won't work are the auto window roll-up on lock (<90) and if you don't have a hatch motor you can't use the hatch release - otherwise you can - any year.

Still a pretty good deal.

Alan

Alan

Dave - from other information on what looks to be the same receiver unit - but with different remotes - it appears this is likely a 433.92 Mhz unit. Can't be certain there aren't different frequency versions available but this is at least a clue. The programming (for pairing) is in the receiver - the remote codes are fixed, you can have up to 3 remotes paired - I've already ordered another full system to get a spare system receiver and 2 more backup remotes.

Alan

yardpro

so if we have the new illuminated hans/champaign switches with the auto up, can it work with them

Alan

Possibly, depends how they are wired and when they are on. Biggest issue may be the windows losing power when you close/lock the car - e.g. the window relay turns off.

I believe if you use the Euro relay Vs. US model instead (for the same year) - you will have windows active (temporarily) whenever the door pin switches show the doors are open - you can then easily fake this with the KE module and a diode, and then a few more diodes to feed the window & sunroof switches.

BTW there is a different KE controller by the same company with a few more features - one of which is window opening on unlock (a secondary mode if you click & hold unlock). On this model the close also requires you to hold the lock to close the windows/sunroof. I'm OK with that - it's how my current system works

I like the idea of this so much I ordered one of those too, along with some flipper keys for evaluation testing...(possibly welding). This express open should be able to work on all 90+ cars - but only if the car is configured in ROW windows mode (likely on Hans' & Paul's express windows too), it does require a bit more work for all these but it's not particularly onerous.

Alan

jwyatt8171

Hi Alan,
Can you provide a link for the RE with the optional output for windows?
Thanks

Alan

The one I already posted does windows express closing but only on an '90 or later (or perhaps with some aftermarket window modules added to an earlier car).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281386288489?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT This one has the flipper remotes and the dual window outputs (close & open). I believe it will work with both types of remotes - but not certain - time will tell - I'll update later. This has the same restrictions on what 928 models it will work on.

It also has a remote indicator LED (not clear you need it) and an external remote learning button - the base model has this internal, you have to open the case up to add additional remotes.

I intend to experiment in making a flipper remote for a 928 key. The long keys may be challenging. I did contact Keys for Classics to see if they had a flip style blank and they say no. It may be possible to mate a steel key to a flipper blank - we shall see. I'll consider that after I test the remotes.

Right now I don't see any offerings with the key head remotes and this type of receiver - however Jack - the guy who runs this store seems very accommodating - he might make up a package for you if you ask. He's been great on the questions I asked him & very fast responding and quick at shipping.

BTW with the keyhead remotes - they don't come with batteries - they take lithium button cells.

Hand annotated instructions suggest buying CR2016's for these - that would work - but the remotes are really designed for the thicker CR2032's that have about 3 times the capacity - I'd use those (and am) - they aren't that much more $. The same may be true of the flipper - though it has room for a rather bigger battery still...? (my Prius remotes of a similar size do still use button cells).

Alan

Hilton

Do you mean 90 or later? I thought 90 was the first year to get the separate window controller? Or is it a function of how the grounds work?

Happy if your statement about 89 is correct - I need to replace the ancient keyless alarm on my '89 as its immobilised the car while driving a couple of times. Consequently the 89 hasn't had much exercise lately.. especially since it stranded my wife on her drive home from work. I haven't been through the 89 wiring diagrams - the only alarm work I've had to do was on my 87's.

Alan

Ahh - Hilton - you are right - its '90+ not '89+ that the change happened.

So revise everything I said before. (BTW I just did for future clarity) In '90 the new relay window controller was fitted - this lasted through '95 unchanged. Earlier cars have some limitations on window functions...

Alan

Tom in Austin

Alan, outstanding effort ... I for one have always preferred a key-remote to a fob as it's more of an OEM look. Are you going to post any further tips or pics on the key blade modification ?

Alan

I will - give me a few days (travelling). I have just ordered 2 of the Silca keys cut to match from keys4classics for the next round of experimentation. I believe the Silca keys shafts will have head ends that are more suitable for the flip key adaptation than the stock steel Huf shaft forked ends. They may indeed be easier/better for both types of adaptation. Though my first effort was with stock Huf key and worked very well.

Alan

ROG100

With a TON of help from Alan I added the "commando" locking system to my GTS about 11 years ago. It has never missed a beat in all that time. One key fob became worn and I swapped it to the second one and life continues. I needed a lot of help as I am electrons challenged.

The point is - if you want a system that is foolproof and works Listen to the MAN (Alan).
Thanks for all you do!!!!

ramcram

I love the idea. I had something very similar on my '94 GTS and I would love to have this on my 2 '86S cars.
Are you just doing yours and sharing the design, or do you plan to offer the kit?

Alan

I will show you how - but no kits - fortunately for this module there is a much reduced need for external components.

For a '91 & GTS:

You essentially need nothing external unless you want the horn to sound. (Can have lock-&-arm/unlock-&-disarm/hatch-&-suspend/interior lights/turn signal confirm/auto windows close - Can add 1 relay for horn confirm, a few diodes for auto windows open+)

+ I haven't tested this mode yet - but I strongly believe it will work just fine.

For any earlier electric lock vehicles (~1980-1990) 2 options:

A. If you ignore the short key function wrt the locks (e.g. Lock == Arm & Unlock == Disarm) OR if you have already removed/disabled the alarm

Then you need nothing extra for the install (Can have lock-&-arm/unlock-&-disarm/hatch-&-disarm*/turn signal confirm - Can add 1 relay for horn confirm, **).

* If electric hatch equipped (and if it works!). On '90 you can also do window close
** For '90 you can also add diodes for window open, and get interior lights too.

B: If you want to maintain the functional difference between the Short & Long keys so that locking/unlocking with the short key doesn't modulate the alarm state then you need 4-6 more diodes for any install. Otherwise the install & features are the same as for A

The only practical value of this mode IMO is if the alarm becomes unreliable and you'd like to be able to lock the car without the alarm being set. You could achieve that with an override switch - which to me would actually be a better solution. There may be a slight security factor - the long key may have more tumblers - anyone know? - does it just engage the alarm switch or actually add tumblers.

NB: I haven't actually tested via anyone else's install that the difference between A: & B: is correct as stated here - but I'm pretty confident that it is true (if not worst case the difference is a ~6 extra diodes). B: here is completely irrelevant if your alarm isn't functional.

Alan