hb4

<Update: See the last post for a link to a thread that explains that the '04' relay that I have does not provide the ability to have the lights up and off. I've checked a US '88 and Canadian import '89 and they both have the '01' relay and can have their lights in the up position and switched off. Based on that, I'm assuming my lights work as intended, but curious about others' experience>

<2nd Update: I replaced the '04' relay with an '01' relay and I can now raise my lights and turn off ignition, then when I turn off the headlight switch the lights turn off and remain up.>

Problem: The headlights on my car do not turn off in the up/active position after turning off ignition and then headlight switch.

Since they switch on and off correctly for normal use (i.e., switch off and lower with ignition on) I figure the headlight switch is working correctly. I'm guessing it's the relay or a sneak ground but without understanding the operation of the relay - especially the two coils not shown in the diagram below (thanks Alan) and not explained by the wiring diagram - I'm stumped.

Suggestions for troubleshooting?

hb4

Any ideas out there?

WallyP

The name of the thread is pretty misleading.

The diagram shown concerns the raising and lowering of the lamps, not the illumination (or at least only indirectly) of the lamps.

The headlamps should not illuminate unless the ignition is on, even if the the headlamp switch is on and they are up. This is one of the most complex wiring systems on the car - you will need the complete wiring diagram and lots of time for study. I have the diagram, but not the time - sorry...

Mrmerlin

BTW what was the last thing you fixed?
take out the relay and clean all 4 of the contacts inside it then refit and see if the condition changes.

supercedar

Bill,
You were in the CE panel for removing the fuel relay for TB/WP. Maybe something there.
Thomas

CraigL

If you're working off the schematic shown above, I'm concerned that the wires involving the motor are drawn incorrectly. As drawn, #1 and #5 seem to be wired in parallel with either 30a or 31 depending on the state of the coil.

Just sayin'

hb4

Sorry for the confusion. The diagram in the OP is from one of Alan's posts, but it doesn't show all of the poles of the relay. I do have the wiring diagram from the manual and below is an excerpt showing the relay, and below is Alan's drawing. If I know how the wires connect in the top diagram where the "?" question mark is, I'd have half a chance of figuring it out.



And here is Alan's diagram



Maybe that's too complicated, and cleaning and re-seating the relay is all that's needed. Anyway, thanks for past and future help.

Alan

The schematic shows the normal means to implement a reversing drive with 2 relays (as porsche uses). only one relay switches at a time. Its important they be at the same potential when not active or the motor will run all the time.

I will see about posting another diagram (will have to dig).

I suspect that your X-relay/supply-relay doesn't work

Alan

hb4

While googling for the operation of the headlight relay (XXIII-XXIV) I found this thread which explains that the '04' relay does not provide the 'off while up' function that the earlier '01' relay did.

928 618 107 01 for old
928 618 107 04 for new

Looking at PET, however, it indicates that the 01 relay is for model (GB), which I assume is Great Britain.

hb4

Feedback: No problems with the wiring in my car.

Colin had an '01 relay and installed it for me. Once that was done I can now walk away from my car with the ignition off and headlights up and off. Good for imitating a frog at cars and coffee.

Curious if anyone has an '04' relay that works this way.

BTW, if you've never had a chance to watch Colin do his magic, you're missing something. Never a missed motion.