Keyless Entry on early 928
10-24-2012, 02:54 PM
#1
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Keyless Entry on early 928
Hi ,
I had a Lux.Pro keyless entry system lying around for some time and planned to install it on my 928S of 1980.
However I could not detect the correct wiring even with the added scheme :
I think the problem is that I do not have a Central Control Unit.
Does any one already installed this on an early 928.
I tried to connect the LOCK wire (2) of the LuxPro unit to the Yellow wire of my Central Locking system , and the UNLOCK wire (5) of the LuxPro unit to the Green/Black wire of my Central Locking system but fuse of LuxPro unit was blown.
thanks
Gerrit
I had a Lux.Pro keyless entry system lying around for some time and planned to install it on my 928S of 1980.
However I could not detect the correct wiring even with the added scheme :
I think the problem is that I do not have a Central Control Unit.
Does any one already installed this on an early 928.
I tried to connect the LOCK wire (2) of the LuxPro unit to the Yellow wire of my Central Locking system , and the UNLOCK wire (5) of the LuxPro unit to the Green/Black wire of my Central Locking system but fuse of LuxPro unit was blown.
thanks
Gerrit
10-24-2012, 03:46 PM
#2
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You need to configure the KE for positive locking not negative locking - this means the KE's: yellow & yellow/black wires need to be connected to +batt as shown in the bottom/left diagram.
Then the KE White & White/Black go to the Car's: Yellow & Green/Black as before
It should work with this configuration.
Alan
Then the KE White & White/Black go to the Car's: Yellow & Green/Black as before
It should work with this configuration.
Alan
10-24-2012, 06:18 PM
#3
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You need to configure the KE for positive locking not negative locking - this means the KE's: yellow & yellow/black wires need to be connected to +batt as shown in the bottom/left diagram.
Then the KE White & White/Black go to the Car's: Yellow & Green/Black as before
It should work with this configuration.
Alan
Then the KE White & White/Black go to the Car's: Yellow & Green/Black as before
It should work with this configuration.
Alan
Is this correct ?
WHat about the current wiring via the key, should they remain together with the KE ?
10-25-2012, 12:51 AM
#4
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Yes that is correct - except that I'm not sure which is which of the Yellow & Green/Black (so they may need to be swapped.. but that will become obvious based on the behaviour).
I don't understand your other question - what other wiring via the key?
Alan
I don't understand your other question - what other wiring via the key?
Alan
10-25-2012, 09:20 AM
#5
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Alan,
what I mean is that I probably need to disconnect the red/white wires (+12V) coming from the fuses and going to pins (1).
Because if I don't , I would create a short circuit since I already have +12V via the KE.
So this means I can activate the Central Locking system only via the KE
and not anymore when turning the key.
kr
Gerrit
what I mean is that I probably need to disconnect the red/white wires (+12V) coming from the fuses and going to pins (1).
Because if I don't , I would create a short circuit since I already have +12V via the KE.
So this means I can activate the Central Locking system only via the KE
and not anymore when turning the key.
kr
Gerrit
10-25-2012, 11:07 AM
#6
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No - don't change anything else.
Basically - it doesnlt matter if you connect Batt+ to Batt+
Only one of the 2 wires Yellow & Green/Black is powered during steady state. If you apply power to the other one - it will cause both locks to change state (and the other one to be come powered), if you apply power to already powered one nothing will happen (e.g. you locked when it was already locked or you unlocked when it was already unlocked).
What you were doing before was applying ground to these lines when locking/unlocking - now that was bad... and spelled death to the fuse...
Alan
Basically - it doesnlt matter if you connect Batt+ to Batt+
Only one of the 2 wires Yellow & Green/Black is powered during steady state. If you apply power to the other one - it will cause both locks to change state (and the other one to be come powered), if you apply power to already powered one nothing will happen (e.g. you locked when it was already locked or you unlocked when it was already unlocked).
What you were doing before was applying ground to these lines when locking/unlocking - now that was bad... and spelled death to the fuse...
Alan
10-25-2012, 01:08 PM
#7
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No - don't change anything else.
Basically - it doesnlt matter if you connect Batt+ to Batt+
Only one of the 2 wires Yellow & Green/Black is powered during steady state. If you apply power to the other one - it will cause both locks to change state (and the other one to be come powered), if you apply power to already powered one nothing will happen (e.g. you locked when it was already locked or you unlocked when it was already unlocked).
What you were doing before was applying ground to these lines when locking/unlocking - now that was bad... and spelled death to the fuse...
Alan
Basically - it doesnlt matter if you connect Batt+ to Batt+
Only one of the 2 wires Yellow & Green/Black is powered during steady state. If you apply power to the other one - it will cause both locks to change state (and the other one to be come powered), if you apply power to already powered one nothing will happen (e.g. you locked when it was already locked or you unlocked when it was already unlocked).
What you were doing before was applying ground to these lines when locking/unlocking - now that was bad... and spelled death to the fuse...
Alan
Could it be that the logic of my original Central Locking system is all integrated in the motors in the doors, preventing to bypass via a KE ?
Are those central locking motors different for later 928 models ??
I know that later 928 models had a Central Locking Unit behind the radio console. I do not have this.
I'm a little confused about how my central locking systems works ...
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10-25-2012, 02:12 PM
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Sorry - wasn't paying attention here - Snip the Orange & Orange/Black - you don't need that ground connections at all that are shown on that bottom diagram - only need the connections I described in the text.
The way it works requires no controller for your year.
Each lock includes a motor that runs in one direction and changes the state of the locks cycling locked -> unlocked > locked etc the motor is controlled by 2 switches one on the key/lock sensing the key position (BTW the key position switch is also moved when the motor cycles), and there is also a position feedback switch on each lock itself that shows what state it is in (locked or unlocked).
in steady state - the lock status switches and the key switches should all be in the same state.
When a key is inserted in either lock and turned to the opposite state of the current state of both locks - then both lock motors drive both locks to the newly commanded state - when they get there then the lock state switch of both locks will cause the motor supply to be interrupted. This works the same in both directions.
Now the key also mechanically moves the lock it is actually inserted into as well - although this is basically redundant for safety/security in case the battery is dead - it could work in electric only mode without it.
Alan
The way it works requires no controller for your year.
Each lock includes a motor that runs in one direction and changes the state of the locks cycling locked -> unlocked > locked etc the motor is controlled by 2 switches one on the key/lock sensing the key position (BTW the key position switch is also moved when the motor cycles), and there is also a position feedback switch on each lock itself that shows what state it is in (locked or unlocked).
in steady state - the lock status switches and the key switches should all be in the same state.
When a key is inserted in either lock and turned to the opposite state of the current state of both locks - then both lock motors drive both locks to the newly commanded state - when they get there then the lock state switch of both locks will cause the motor supply to be interrupted. This works the same in both directions.
Now the key also mechanically moves the lock it is actually inserted into as well - although this is basically redundant for safety/security in case the battery is dead - it could work in electric only mode without it.
Alan
Last edited by Alan; 10-25-2012 at 02:51 PM.
10-25-2012, 02:30 PM
#9
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Thread Starter
Sorry - wasn't paying attention here - Snip the Orange & Orange/Black - you don't need that ground connections at all that are shown on that bottom diagram - only need the connections I described in the text.
The way it works requires no controller for your year.
Each lock includes a motor that runs in one direction and changes the state of the locks cycling locked -> unlocked > locked etc the motor is controlled by 2 switches one on the key/lock sensing the key posistion (BTW the key posistion switch is also moved when the motor cycles), and there is also a position feedback switch on the lock itself that shows what state it is in (locked or unlocked).
in steady state - the lock status switches and the key switches should all be in the same state.
When a key is inserted in either lock and turned to the opposite state of the current state of both locks - then both lock motors drive both locks to the newly commanded state - when they get there then the lock state switch of both locks will cause the motor supply to be interrupted. This works the same in both directions.
Now the key also mechanically moves the lock it is actually inserted into as well - although this is basically redundant for safety/security in case the battery is dead - it could work in electric only mode without it.
Alan
The way it works requires no controller for your year.
Each lock includes a motor that runs in one direction and changes the state of the locks cycling locked -> unlocked > locked etc the motor is controlled by 2 switches one on the key/lock sensing the key posistion (BTW the key posistion switch is also moved when the motor cycles), and there is also a position feedback switch on the lock itself that shows what state it is in (locked or unlocked).
in steady state - the lock status switches and the key switches should all be in the same state.
When a key is inserted in either lock and turned to the opposite state of the current state of both locks - then both lock motors drive both locks to the newly commanded state - when they get there then the lock state switch of both locks will cause the motor supply to be interrupted. This works the same in both directions.
Now the key also mechanically moves the lock it is actually inserted into as well - although this is basically redundant for safety/security in case the battery is dead - it could work in electric only mode without it.
Alan
put +12V from battery to KE - Yellow wire
put +12V from battery to KE - Yellow/Black wire
connect KE-White wire to PorscheCentralLocking-White wire
connect KE-White/Black wire to PorscheCentralLocking-White/Black wire
kr
Gerrit
10-27-2012, 11:39 AM
#11
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Alan,
it still doesn't work.
What I did by means of test was : I disconnected the power to the right central locking motor by removing the fuse.
I then used the following wiring scheme :
Now by pressing lock, I could turn the left central locking motor, but it turned 360° (so lock and unlock again).
However, when I reconnected the power to the right central locking motor, and when pressing lock again, the fuse (of power right central locking motor) was blown. I even measure the current flowing and it went even above 20A !
So there must be a shortcircuit somewhere...
I'm desperate now....which scheme should I use, because when checking the forum post regarding this, they only treat keyless entry for later models ('84 onwards)...
thanks
Gerrit
it still doesn't work.
What I did by means of test was : I disconnected the power to the right central locking motor by removing the fuse.
I then used the following wiring scheme :
Now by pressing lock, I could turn the left central locking motor, but it turned 360° (so lock and unlock again).
However, when I reconnected the power to the right central locking motor, and when pressing lock again, the fuse (of power right central locking motor) was blown. I even measure the current flowing and it went even above 20A !
So there must be a shortcircuit somewhere...
I'm desperate now....which scheme should I use, because when checking the forum post regarding this, they only treat keyless entry for later models ('84 onwards)...
thanks
Gerrit
10-27-2012, 12:23 PM
#12
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What I described to you should work - you have something connected wrongly and still have a ground in the circuit somewhere...
You need both fuses in place
All that is needed - and you can check this manually - is that you connect 12v (pref via a fuse) to either the yellow or green/black wires. Try it.
For steady state current to flow & blow a fuse you still have a ground connection at the relay, or you have the wrong wires...
And again - your central locks do work normally from both sides with the key - correct?
Alan
You need both fuses in place
All that is needed - and you can check this manually - is that you connect 12v (pref via a fuse) to either the yellow or green/black wires. Try it.
For steady state current to flow & blow a fuse you still have a ground connection at the relay, or you have the wrong wires...
And again - your central locks do work normally from both sides with the key - correct?
Alan
10-27-2012, 07:47 PM
#13
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What I described to you should work - you have something connected wrongly and still have a ground in the circuit somewhere...
You need both fuses in place
All that is needed - and you can check this manually - is that you connect 12v (pref via a fuse) to either the yellow or green/black wires. Try it.
For steady state current to flow & blow a fuse you still have a ground connection at the relay, or you have the wrong wires...
And again - your central locks do work normally from both sides with the key - correct?
Alan
You need both fuses in place
All that is needed - and you can check this manually - is that you connect 12v (pref via a fuse) to either the yellow or green/black wires. Try it.
For steady state current to flow & blow a fuse you still have a ground connection at the relay, or you have the wrong wires...
And again - your central locks do work normally from both sides with the key - correct?
Alan
Each time the 0.4A fuse of one of the powerlines to the central locking motors
was blown and one of the central locking motors turned around completely (so lock+unlock or unlock+lock )
Strangely enough it works via key on both sides !
This was the last wire scheme I applied :
Do you know anyone who installed a KE system on an early 928 ?
Perhaps it is not possible ?
kr
Gerrit
10-27-2012, 11:11 PM
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It has been done exactly the way I am telling you. I think you must have the wrong wires.
If you trace the circuit one of the Yellow and Green/Black wires always gets 12v and which one switches based on locked or unlocked. The only path to ground here is via the motors (so they will run).
Test the KE with a multimeter in ohms mode - when you lock/unlock do you ever see connectivity to Gnd on the White & White/Black wires - if so that's the problem.
Are you sure the connections to the KE are correct - no other internal connections, the ones you are using are correct...?
Alan
If you trace the circuit one of the Yellow and Green/Black wires always gets 12v and which one switches based on locked or unlocked. The only path to ground here is via the motors (so they will run).
Test the KE with a multimeter in ohms mode - when you lock/unlock do you ever see connectivity to Gnd on the White & White/Black wires - if so that's the problem.
Are you sure the connections to the KE are correct - no other internal connections, the ones you are using are correct...?
Alan
10-28-2012, 09:56 AM
#15
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Interesting upgrade, I was thinking about doing the same thing. Is the vacuum system deactivated for this? Or is it posible to activate the driver's door only so the vacuum system takes care of rhe passenger side? As far as I can see the driver's door on my '78 is not vacuum operated but gives a signal to the passenger's side. Or am I mistaken?