hacker-pschorr

Hey now, the "T" and "D" keys are close together.

FlyingDog

I did. Sort of.

hacker-pschorr

I have a feeling it is now more than the throwout bearing......now that begs the question, how could a failing throwout bearing cause a IP to go bad?

FlyingDog

I don't see how it could effect the adjusters or the springs, but it could cause extra wear.

hacker-pschorr

I had a thought (chime in people if I'm off here) the throw out bearings (also known as the release bearing) job is to allow the pressure plate & intermediate plate to continue to spin with the engine when the clutch in engaged. It has zero contact with the shaft, the clutch disks, or the intermediate plate. So how could that cause the clutch to drag when you depress the clutch pedal? This makes no sense.

Now if the pilot bearing were to go bad, that would cause the clutch disks to keep spinning with the engine when the clutch is depressed. If the grease in the pilot bearing were "sticking" when the car is cold, then heat up, this makes some sense (it's a stretch).

So did you mean to say the pilot bearing? If I'm right and you are looking for a pilot bearing, the cost difference is at least $100 between that and the release bearing.

hacker-pschorr

Ok, now what?

Picked up the car last night to nurse it home after traffic died down. All the way home (ok, only 5 miles) it shifted perfect. I decided to go for a drive, see what happens. I was over shifting, trying to get the clutch to slip up - going down the highway, I was shownshifting to 4th - 3rd, then back up again. In my driveway, went from 1st to reverse, over and over rolling the car up and down the driveway (neighbors already think I'm a bit strange), shifted into reverse 100% silky smooth every time.

This almost seams temperature related now - it was very cool last night (40 degrees maybe). Except before, it would stick when cold. I dunno - new shaft and pilot bearing are on the way. I looked through my records, found the pilot bearing could be quite old, they are cheap so I ordered one.

Tom. M

It could be the disks hanging on the shaft....when cold...metal shrinks..so maybe more play...more movement?....either way...go with the shaft and the pilot bearing WYAIT...and make sure you use the special Porsche grease ($25 for a lifetime supply from 928 Intl.) for the int. shaft.....(I haven't heard of a replacement for this grease as of yet but I'm sure there is something suitable available locally).

Good luck,
Tom
89GT

hacker-pschorr

I'm not sure what Jim Page uses for lubing up the clutch shaft - I know it's not the Porsche stuff, but it has been working fine on my 79 and another friends car for many years now.

I spoke with Jim's lead mechanic who was working on my car with Jim, he did the final test drive. When he parked the car on Monday, it was not releasing. They did not touch the car after that test drive. I'm not going to take it apart until it acts up again. No road trips planned for a while, so I'm going to put around town this weekend in it, see if I can recreate the problem.

Good news (at least to my novice brain) this could mean the IP is fine since once it shifts forward, nothing in the clutch mechanism is going to force it back, so something else must be sticking.

SharkSkin

My DD clutch drags a bit until I've driven a couple blocks in the morning. For those first couple blocks, I keep it in first because if I go to 2nd or 3rd I have a hard time getting it back into 1st when I have to stop for a turn onto another street then a stop sign maybe 150 ft. later. After that, it's about 1/4 mile to a stoplight on that street, and by then all is well. After that, I still can't get it into 1st above walking speed without a 50-50 chance of hearing gear grunch, so I don't try, but otherwise it works as it should. I've checked it a few times, and the "T" adjusters are not migrating as yours seem to be... just another data point for you, FWIW.

BC

Yes, same with my 86 Dave. It won't come out of or go into gear very well when cold, and I don't think its trans, but it could be both.

FlyingDog

H-P, my pilot bearing doesn't turn smoothly either, but it's not as bad as the release bearing. I noticed some wear on the non-splined portion of my intermediate shaft, I'll see if that lines up with the guide tube which also has some wear. If the release bearing was fighting turning, it could be pushed to the side pushing the guide tube into the intermediate shaft.

There was one day that my clutch completely fixed itself. It didn't last long.

hacker-pschorr

Matt, I still don't see how a bad release bearing could cause a clutch to hang-up. I've heard of release bearings completely disintegrating, making all kinds of noise in the process.

Tom. M

Just a quick question Hacker...have you bled the clutch system recently?...may be worth doing...ususally trapped air will manifest itself as a pedal that drops to the floor..but maybe you are not getting full slave actuation all the time???.. just some swags...

Do the master bleed inside the car by removing pedal linkage, pulling circlip and letting piston slide out till the second seal is present..and then tip down a bit..should leak air/fluid....and drain till no more air or clean fluid is present... I helped with this on Shanes recently purchased 86.5 5sp..(Sharktoberfest) and it helped his shifting somewhat..

Later,
Tom
89GT

FlyingDog

I'm beginning to agree with you, but I haven't found anything else that's bad in there. The intermediate shaft splines are fine, the discs and plates are fine, when actuating the clutch everything sperated as it's supposed to... if it's not the bearings, I don't know what it is.

hacker-pschorr

Tom,
Fluid is very new, bled with a power bleeder. I was thinking about bleeding it again anyway, cannot hurt anything.

Matt,
I am not sure if this is even possible, but if a pilot beairng were to start hanging up, it would keep both friction disks, the shaft, and the transmission spinning at or close to engine speed.