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Measuring Pinion Depth Using VW385 Tool - Help Pete!!!
Pete, Steve or any other 915 Expert........
Having replaced the roller bearings on the main and pinion shafts during my 2nd and 3rd gear replacement, it's now time to check the pinion depth and determine the proper number/thickness of shims to be inserted between the differential housing and my new one-piece Wevo XT-032 Bearing Retainer Plate.
The factory manual prescribes the use of VW385/53 (a 14mm contact point) and VW385/14 (the screw contact plunger) assembled and screwed into the main gauge bar VW385/1. Then, using the Master Plate VW385/52 placed on the magnetic contact positions on the VW385/1 gauge, insure that the contact point has a 1mm preload on the dial indicator attached to the end of the VW385/1 Gauge Bar.
So here's my question. ..... It would seem that the VW385/52 Master Plate is no longer available for purchase (I checked at Porsche.snapon.com and VW.snapon.com and audi.snapon.com - no go.....), it seems that you can use the Adjustable Master Gauge VW385/30 as a substitute. HOWEVER, at what depth must one set the Adjustable Master Gauge (think of it as a depth indicator) to attain the correct distance from the VW385/1 to mimic the VW385/52 Master Plate? I tried setting the VW385/30 at the specified 66.30mm and that appears to be too tall as there can be no pre-load on the VW385/1 using that distance. Can one of the 915 experts help me or provide the precise "depth" measurement of the original VW385/52 Master Gauge?
And one other note of frustration....... The small plastic cam that translates the depth movements of the VW385/14 and VW385/53 combo pointer is VERY FRAGILE AND NO LONGER AVAILABLE from any source. If the attachment barrel on the cam breaks, you just created a nice $1000 straight, round bar!!!!!! As far as I can tell, the only remedy is to buy a NEW VW385/1 tool from SnapOn for $964.32!!!!! Does anyone have a source for this plastic cam - VW385-1-3? If so, I will buy it from you!!!! I'm looking for a replacement that I can give to a local machine shop so that they can machine a new one in metal!
Any help available from the 915 experts would be much appreciated!
Toby
(P.S. - And Steve Weiner, don't tell me that REAL mechanics simply use the wear pattern to set depth!! You KNOW my eyesight isn't THAT good!
Did you find any resolution to your problem? I have 2 VW 385 mandrels that have broken plastic cams in them. Luckily, I have a third mandrel that is in perfect working order….I would like to repair the other two. If you have any luck please let me know!
Are you sure that Snap On sells the 385/1? Did you confirm this recently? That sounds odd to me but I'd like to know more….
Toby, do you need to check the pinion depth because of the new bearings, the Wevo one-piece plate, or both?
I will someday (soon, I hope) have to deal with this as well, and I am not sure that new bearings or the one-piece plate will change the pinion depth setting?
@hotrod619.... Yes, Snap-On sells the VW385 toolset as well as individual components of the entire set. You have to go to Porsche.snapon.com or vw.snapon.com or audi.snapon.com and you can search on VW385 to find all of their listings. These sites DO NOT, however, carry the sub-components for the VW385/1 measuring gauge. I found a singular reference to the plastic cam, VW385/1-3, on the Samstag tool site in their list of VW special tools. Although Samstag did not have the piece any longer, I was able to confirm that the VW385/1-3 part number is, in fact, the plastic cam.
@Mark,
Yes, new bearings/races and the Wevo 1-piece plate have been installed. In theory, there should be no change in depth, but that assumes that the bearings and races match what came out exactly AND that I pressed the races in to the same depth in the case as the prior races. Given the close tolerances, I have elected to do the measurement.
UPDATE ON THE PLASTIC CAM: The good news in this situation is that I found someone local here in Dallas that has a 3-D scanner and we have printed some replacement parts on a 3-D printer. First example came out very close in tolerances, and the second examples should come later this week. BETTER NEWS is that I've been in touch with Peiseler in Germany. This is the original manufacturer of the VW385 measuring gauge. Since Peiseler originally only sold the tool to Matra who then resold the tool as a VW385 tool, you could not buy directly from Peiseler. However, with Matra having been bought out by Bosch, one can buy direct from Peiseler. Apparently, Peiseler found 3 or 4 pieces of the VW385/1-3 plastic cam and I offered to buy them ALL! I'm waiting for them to arrive from Germany, and then my 3-D printer machinist will have an original, unbroken piece to use as a model.
Thanks Toby. Makes sense. I also knew that Pete's 915 rebuild wiki doesn't seem to worry about pinion depth changes from new bearings, so I had been wondering.
I've got a used R&P from Gary Fairbanks that I'm going with. I won't have any choice other than adjusting the shim thickness based on the marked differences between my old R&P and the new one, confirmed with gear marking compound/wear pattern.
Toby: That's great news! If available for sale, I am interested in purchasing at least 2 new cams. Let me know when/how to proceed. Contact me directly at: info@atxautosport.com
Joe, I will check with my machine shop that "printed" the cam replacements. Still waiting for the Peiseler parts to show from Germany. Once the originals come in, we can figure out how to image and print some additional pieces. Keep checking with me on this - tpennycuff@tx.rr.com
Thanks Toby. Makes sense. I also knew that Pete's 915 rebuild wiki doesn't seem to worry about pinion depth changes from new bearings, so I had been wondering.
I've got a used R&P from Gary Fairbanks that I'm going with. I won't have any choice other than adjusting the shim thickness based on the marked differences between my old R&P and the new one, confirmed with gear marking compound/wear pattern.
Mark
Hey, guys. Something went very wrong with my Tutorial, and the oversight of a pinion shaft depth discussion. I do not know what happened, but for some reason the pictures/use of the 385 got dropped. I have no excuse and take full responsibility for the problem.
That said, I did perform the pinion depth set-up on the Tutorial transmission, and have the photos. The requirements for pinion depth measurement are as follows:
1. Replace transmission case
2. Replace ring & pinion
3. Replace large cylindrical roller bearing and 4-point bearing for drive pinion.
FYI; I have never encountered a situation where the S3 (pinion depth shims) had to be changed to a different thickness total because I replaced the two mentioned bearings.
Sorry to have been missing in action, I've had a couple of health issues to work through this year. Thankfully I seem to be doing OK - today, anyway!
Well, the rebuild is complete. Finished the assembly tonight. Tons of help and coaching from big-time buddy Jimmy Hays, a GoldMesiter Porsche technician. New 2nd, 3rd and 4th gears. New synchros and bearings. Added the Wevo cooling solution too. Hayden does awesome work! Time to get the transmission bolted up to the engine and installed back in the car. Plumb the external cooler and off for resetting the rebuilt suspension (all Elephant Racing parts!). Can't wait to get Tweety back out on track!!!
And here you go Boys and Girls! These little guys are black plastic gold for any owner of a VW385/1 tool.
If you own a VW385/1 tool, this cam is GOING to break! And BTW, Peiseler is OUT of the specialized tool manufacturing business now. These two pieces are reputed to be THE LAST TWO PIECES!
I have a machinist that I plan to ask to generate a NC program so we can make metal copies. Anybody got a WHIZ of a machinist they know? I've already been approached by two folks asking about this part!
But I'm serious about the 3d printing thing. That's how I would tackle this project if it were mine. We 3d printed oil lines inside of the gearbox on our proprietary gt3 Cup sequential project.
^ That is what we did earlier in the summer using the broken piece from my tool. It came out pretty good, but with pieces this small, you really need a scanner that has really good resolution. Now that we have a virgin piece, we're going to try again and see how close we can get.
And, I would love to find a way to take the 3D printer input data stream (the scan data and coordinates) and convert that into a CNC program so that a milling machine could make these in metal instead of plastic.
Just stumbled across this old thread. Toby, did you ever get the cams manufactured? No immediate need, but never know what the future holds.
For these tools, try Zelenda. I have bought VW, Audi, Porsche transmission tools from them for twenty years and always been pleased with the service. They often have good used tools, not sure the source but am guessing turn-backs of mandatory sets from dealerships.
Pete, for most Porsche models I am with you: the S3 does not measure differently from what comes from the factory. My experience has been that they got sloppy with the 968 series cars, maybe old tooling or too many beers at lunch, who knows. And if anyone's ever been inside the gearbox before, you never know what they've done. I've heard various bits of religion applied like "yeah, I always run a little more [or less] depth than the factory and it's better that way." Yikes.
05-27-2014, 11:55 AM
Measuring Pinion Depth Using VW385 Tool - Help Pete!!!
Does anyone have a source for this plastic cam - VW385-1-3? If so, I will buy it from you!!!! I'm looking for a replacement that I can give to a local machine shop so that they can machine a new one in metal! 
